Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

The Outlaws are going to a softer H-R15 RR tire this year. Schatz was already b!tching about last year's tires being stuck too hard on his way to 26 wins. Everyone is fighting to loosen their cars up since they switched back to Hoosier as it is. They should at least make it illegal to cut or sipe them up, so low buck guys can run them a couple of races and to save a bunch of unneccesary work for the teams cutting up tires all night. 410 car counts were starting to turn the corner the last 5-7 years after they started unhooking them. Now they are trying to f' them up and let 900 hp motors be the name of the game again instead of driver and setup.

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

Sounds like some good old rubber down follow the leader racing to me. OBTW race fans that will be $40 a head please.

People just love to be negative!!!!

If the drivers are saying the cars were stuck too hard with last years tire then why would they even use the new softer tire? Really, how many guys are going to say "my car is too hooked up, better bolt on a softer tire"

We will have to wait and see. while a softer tire will bite harder at first it will give up a lot sooner in a 30 lap race we will just have to see 

That's a good idea. Don't let them groove or sipe the tires, that way they blister after 1 race and the low dollar guys have to buy more. 

If you don't spin them or cut them up, right rears can go a couple races and left rears many. If blistering is such a big problem as you claim, and it's not except for the very fastest of tracks, Hoosier can permanently change the tread pattern to the most conducive for tire life . Cutting them up instantly shortens their life and instantly creates a lot of unnecessary work for race teams. Not sure where we got to the point where you are not allowed any common sense in racing concerning wasting money hand over fist. Most major race series don't allow you to touch your tires.

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

As much as people bitched about Goodyear, the racing has dropped off in quality since they went back to Hoosiers. I've no doubt they make a better tire, but it is not conducive to better racing necessarily.

Most major race series don't allow you to touch your tires.

Can you elaborate on which ones those are? Thanks, 

No big surprise. Hoosier is in business to make money not save the raceteams any, or make racing better. I'm only surprised it took this long. When the racing quality suffers because everyone is hooked up and can't pass and when the car counts start dropping due to the expense of short-life gummies; the sprint car world will be looking for a solution again just like a decade ago...enter AR or GY.

A

The big leagues can't touch their tires. They don't even own them, they are leased. They get them before the race and have to return them afterward. A lot of Saturday night series have no cut, groove or sipe rules as well. They don't allow for cutting up a tire so it only lasts one race. The tread pattern must remain as it came out of the mold so they can get multiple nights out of a tire. Race team tire bills are second only to their engine bills in many cases. Huge savings can be realized with just a little common sense.

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

 THIS Sir is a load of TRASH Schatz was already b!tching about last year's tires being stuck too hard on his way to 26 wins. Everyone is fighting to loosen their cars up since they switched back to Hoosier as it is

The racing has never been worse since they went to a H tire. The only reason they are going to a softer tire is to help the rest of the WOO drivers catch up to Schatz. They thought years ago taking away Dish Wings and RD tyres would even out the playing field. Well guess what CUBIC that didn't do anything but cost a shit tonne of money for everyone in 410 and Schatz still wins. There's more rubber down races than ever because they all still struggle to hook their 950 HP motors up that they still spend loads of cash developing.  

And the only reason 410 racing car counts have maybe been on the improve is becasue the cost of a 360 motor is a joke and a lot of them have moved to 410, you just have to look at Knoxville Weekly to see that. 

I'll bet a lot of low buck, Mom and Dad teams spend / waste more money on wrapping their sprintcars, mules and having transporters they can't afford, than they do worrying about making sure they have decent rubber on their cars every night and instead of having 1 really bad ass car and 1 motor they have 2 or 3 ordinary ones of each .. Some of these teams should probably get their priorities right .. 

Really, the guys I know that run IMCA (for peanuts) groove, sipe and grind their tires just like the sprint car guys do.  They give up the ghost after a race or two and they sell them used to teams that can't afford to every buy new tires.

Yes, NASCAR doesn't "allow" teams to touch tires.

But the true Big League (F1) allows teams to use tire warmers to have the tires at optimum temp before a race even starts.

Personally, I could care less about them allowing a softer tire.  It only helps for a few laps (time trials) and then it's no better than the harder tire.

The rule they need to change is allowing teams to CHANGE tires before the feature in WoO racing (as it stands today, your tires only have to last TT, heat and dash before you can change them at a WoO event (what is that, at most 15 laps??  It's no wonder they all are running the softest tire available.  Make them run the same tire all night and that soft tire option is thrown out the window by 99% of the competitors IMO.

My grooving iron has SAVED me a ton of money over the years I was driving a sprintcar, midget, or minisprint. First of all I could never buy tires so soft that they were worn away after one session on the track. Frequently I operated off donated used tires from the teams that can bolt on new every time out.

With the grooving iron, I would run once or twice on the factory tread pattern, then I would cut half the blocks in half to get some new sharp edges, then after a race or two I would groove the rest of the blocks and have fresh sharp edges again for a night.

My siper would allow a tire that had already been heat cycled a couple times to heart up and come in a little quicker so again it helped make used tires work a bit better.

For the life of me I can not understand how grooving and siping costs a team more money (unless they are paying a crew member to do it, which most low buck teams aren't doing).

If the tires are too soft to last more than 20-30 laps it doesn't matter what you do to them because they are going to get thrown away since all the tread is gone.

If tires are hard enough to last multiple nights a groover & siper can help freshen one up a little. Still not as good as a new one, but better than a used one with worn out edges.

So please somebody explain to me how banning grooving and siping would save money. Also explain to me which major DIRT series confiscates/leases all the tires to the teams and doesn't allow the teams to do anything with them.

Loose is when you hit the wall with the rear of the
car, tight is when you hit the wall with the front of
the car. Horsepower is how fast you hit the wall and
torque is how far you move the wall.

i don't know of any DIRT series that leases/confiscates tires, or any weekly track that does either. We've bought used tires from Ascs and WoO teams both to run at our weekly tracks. In fact, I have a buddy with a crate LM that buys his tires (used) from his neighbor that happens to be a Lucas Oil LM series contender. 

The only time I've ever heard of a tire being confiscated was to be sent to a lab to test for softeners when the sniffer alarmed. 

There is no replacement for cubic displacement 

The name of the game now is to cut up and sipe a tire as much as possible without it chunking out. They cut it up as much as they can and still have it last the race. A tire will last a lot longer if you don't cut it all up. It can last a couple of races if it is hard enough. All they do is hit it with a grinder to take the seal off before the next race, and on a lot of track surfaces it will run with a new tire.... except if you cut up the brand new tire to begin with so it only lasts one race.

People haven't said much about the rules in several years because car counts were headed in the right direction across the country. For the past five years they didn't cave into the teams who wanted a softer tire. Not sure why they finally did this year. The cost of 900hp engines kills local sprint car racing. It really is just that simple. Only give them enough tire to use 800hp.

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

No one mentioned it, but when they to this Hoosier they took away 2 inches of width 16 vs. 18 before.

the goodyears they ran a couple of years ago were 16 in as well.

to indy and beyond!!

Siping a tire makes it last longer. Proven fact. Grooving gives you more grip from a tire that has already been used. If you would like truly schooled on this youre welcome to come over and I will show you the difference. Or you can continue to blow smoke about a topic you apparently know nothing about. A non siped tire on a dirt modified (700 hp motors, and a 60 compound) last two nights tops if we are lucky. A siped tire lasts us 4 to 6 nights minumum. It disapates the heat and keeps from melting the rubber as quickly.