Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

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“This benefits us zero,” Ott said. “We put on a show here and, basically, we get taxed for putting on that show. We are willing to lose $500 to a $1,000 a night to compete, but it seems like it is getting more, more and more.

“I feel it’s time as a car owner to take control of how we spend money. I think we should have a little more say about the rules when we are the ones who are spending the money.”

Knoxville may be the mecca of winged sprintcars. But PA is the marrow. I too, agree with Mr Ott.

The greatest knowledge is to know that you know nothing
at all.

Any chance Mr Ott might want to lower the price of his motors? haha

If the tracks don't all have their hands out for money from the tire comapnies, you could get RR's for $180. If AR or Hoosier has to pay all the tracks to make them exclusive, get ready for a price increase.The best way would be to have a durometer and size check like the late models do. Run whatever you want as long as it meets this spec....

ha ha, good observation, Although I can understand Mr Ott's bark in this fight, (im much much more of a budget minded racer than he is) I would have approached the issue with a little bit of discression from his shoes so to speek, Mr Ott should have appointed a puppetier,a "spokesman" with all strings in his hands, why target yourself as that guy, Isnt he kinda speeking out of both sides of his mouth here? $230 for a tire is unreasonable, but $50-60k for a mill is quite fine? He proubly stepped into something he didnt think would reflect his buisness withut stopping to think about it , no biggy I do it all the time, but im not a buisnessman, my bread and butter comes from avenues not even resembeling the racing world, a less contriversial spokesman should have been set in place, I have to agree with Ott's belief but im not a tire salesman either, guess im just spinning a visious circle here, my moma always told me, not to throw rocks from a glass house.

Good point. The difference being, Ott(or anyone elses) engines only fetch what the market will bear. The same can't be said for tire prices and sanctioning bodies that require you to run something at a "set" a price, and then can't/won't even enforce that price.

The greatest knowledge is to know that you know nothing
at all.

Just say no to the Outlaw tire tax. F the Outlaws.

http://blog.pennlive.com/patriotnewssports/2012/08/don_ott_trying_to_organize_own.html

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

http://blog.pennlive.com/patriotnewssports/2012/08/don_ott_trying_to_organize_own.html

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

cubiii you do not even have the details yet and your b1tchin. do you have a horse in this race by the way or just a complainer. If the tracks go one way or another it is a business call good or bad they are made every day. what is the cost of a mid range tire on your car cost these days? maybe you get a Chinese tire made to work for the sprints

Only a jackass would think it is alright for every little guy across the country to have to pay a $40 tax per tire to support a couple of Outlaw teams....teams that already have nascar sponsorship thru Tony Stewart and Kasey Kahne. I bet if you asked Tony Stewart, even he would think this tax is assinine. Wake up already. Some of you people really amaze me sometimes.

This is how it is supposed to work. Not the other way around....

AMERICAN RACER TIRE RETURNS TO URC WITH GREAT PRICING

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

I'll try to look at this objectively.

Could tires cost $180 instead of $220 from American Racer (yes)

If you went to an open tire rule, would Mr. Ott buy the $180 American Racers or a $300 (hypothetical cost) brand XX tire because brand XX has more grip? (my guess is he'd buy brand XX)

Therein lies the problem, the team owners, and drivers bit*h and complain about tire prices, but when there was an open tire rule they always bought the most expensive ones because that's what the fast teams were running and they "must have an advantage with their tires".

Like them or hate them, a one brand tire rule is the answer (ask a Late Model Team how much $$ in tires they have in their hauler at any one time, you'd be amazed at how much they have wrapped up in "open" tire rules).

The biggest issue is this, The WoO, Williams Grove, Lincoln, Knoxville, Lernerville, etc., need to tell the tire companies that they'll sign a contract no problem, but the tires have to last a MINIMUM of 3 nights of racing for that $220 and that a tire rule will be in effect at ALL events that the same tire must be used for Time Trials, Heats, Dash and Feature and then still be able to be ran again 2 more racenights (so basically make them hockey pucks).

That is the biggest difference between tires today and tires of the 80's. There were all kinds of teams that ran used tires for weekly shows in the 80's (and some ran them at Outlaw shows as well). The big teams that could afford to buy new tires all the time could sell their used tires to local teams so it was a win/win for everyone.

The tires of today last 1 night tops (and some don't even last all night anymore).

But, the car owners don't realize that they are being protected from themselves (open up the tire rule and you'll see teams that complain today spend twice what they are spending today on tires within 2 years (especially if American Racer and Hoosier both make quality tires but one has an advantage over the other at certain tracks).

How have race organizations that have been run by the race team owners fared over the years? CART comes to mind immediately for me (went out of business because of NO FANS, NO CARS, AND OUT OF CONTROL COSTS FOR THE TEAM OWNERS), and IndyCar seems to be headed that direction again (the owners don't like the fact that the series no longer plays favorites and even the little teams are capable of winning, so let's go back to the old way of doing things so only the big teams compete for wins, car counts go down, and fans quit coming to watch follow the leader racing).

But let's all get behind Mr. Ott and lobby for these open tire rules and then get on the message boards 2 years from now and complain that something has to be done to control costs so car owners will come back to the sport...

Although there is some merit to arguement about Ott's engine price Ott motors are not mandated to compete at any track or race.

Drivers and owners complain about the costs of tires but in the end, they will buy whatever makes them go faster. If they would reduce the size of the wings by 15%-20% and cut back the width of ther rear wheels/tires by 3"-4", it would negate the hp and put more emphasis on the drivers.

You seem to ignore the many race tracks who have also benefited from extra money from Goodyear through this deal. Oh Cubes and your ODS (Outlaw Derangement Syndrome)

Mr. Ott's motors are not mandated, therefore, we as car owners DO have a choice in whose motors we run, what extra little goodies we decide to have included that drive up the price of said motor. WE AS OWNERS ARE ALLOWED TO MAKE THAT CHOICE!

Mandated tires by the sanctioning bodies and then the local tracks (i.e. Williams Grove and all the other PA tracks feel that they need to follow suit) are NOT A CHOICE BEING MADE BY THE CAR OWNERS! Oh, yea, right, the choice we could make would be NOT TO RACE.

We choose to race locally, not "on tour". Do you understand that the huge amount of money being paid by the tire manufacturer to WoO and Allstars is being paid to their "top 5-10" teams as "tow money" or "contract fees". The local teams are NOT being paid any of that "point fund" money to show up at the track every week.

We know going in we are loosing money when we drive thru the gate but that is a choice we are making because we love to race and so do the people on our team and our sponsors. However, it is only a fair expectation that we have a fair and reasonable expectation to earn back part of that cost in purse money.

One of the biggest issues with the mandated tires is that the manufacturer is paying the tracks money into the "point fund" for being the track tire. However, that money is NOT going to the point fund and I do not care what any promoter/owner is telling you - it is NOT in the point fund. When a 10th place finish cannot pay $1,000 considering the amount of money being paid to the track by the tire manufacturer as "point fund"; then there really is no extra money going into the point fund.

People on message boards are complaining because car counts are low, teams don't take off work w/o pay or use vacation time to go to mid-week races is because with the cost of tires, travel and pit fees - it just can't be justified. Most especially for all those "regualar" teams. Those 5 that have "full time professional" drivers - different story.

It would be nice once in a while if someone who spouts off that they know it all, would take the time to actually talk to the "regular" car owners and find out just exactly what the cost in terms of time and money it takes to run a fairly budgeted successful local race team.

No one is holding a gun to the track promotors heads to make them sign the tire deal, they are doing it on their own.

I won't argue that currently anyone can buy an MC2 for around $180, but can they buy the one that the Outlaws will be mandating for that? probably not, the Outlaws are asking that the tire have a stiffer sidewall and different construction, that makes this new tire one that currently isn't even on the market.

Again, I'll put it this way. If track XX isn't EVER going to have a WoO race at their track, but they run 410's on a regular basis, they have NO REASON to institute the WoO tire rule, so therefore they aren't subsidizing the 7 or so teams that run every WoO race.

The Goodyear deal put $$$ in the track owners/promotors pockets as well, not just the WoO. That $$ that the tire cost more was put into the point funds at most tracks (probably not all). So, basically the teams were getting a "rebate" at the end of the season on what they spent on tires all year long at track XX.

But, I can see if from both sides, but I have a hard time believing that any driver or team owner will buy a $180 tire if there is a better tire (makes the car go faster) on hte market if they have an open tire rule (even if that better tire cost $300).

Doesn't anyone remember the last couple of years prior to Hoosier getting the WoO contract and then Goodyear following them 3 years later. Seven years ago the Hoosiers were More Expensive, didn't last as long, but were faster than the other tires on the market at the time (Goodyear and McCreary). Rather than allowing Hoosier to continue to increase their tire prices (which they were), the WoO signed a contract which forced Hoosier to keep tire prices at a certain level (even though Hoosier could have demanded much more than that on the open market). Plus there was the issue with certain teams getting the latest and greatest tire when it was an open tire rule, but no one else could buy them (Steve Kinser had a Hoosier sponsorship, he had tires at his disposal that no other team did, same as Sammy did with Goodyear in the 80's when he was helping them develop their tires). I saw a lot of BRAND NEW tires that would get slit and thrown away because Hoosier didn't want ANY other teams to be able to bolt those tires on because they weren't available to anyone else, only Steve).