Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

It is a good thing that you marked that mower so you could know that and catch the fire fighter big story. right

I think he said mower not mowers

I might have to back Really ???? up. They are they same mowers that have been used for years. If one hit something and needed work that's one thing, but destroyed, lets not exaggerate. I will say that is a new story that I haven't heard about why you are raising rates and the campground rules. The majority of the campground was/is torqued off over the rules, that began with your not guaranteed your spot back and than later on in them it said to pick up your concrete and gravel.

I have to laugh at this statement. The mowing contract was awarded to someone new last season. Highly doubt that the person that had the contract the year prior "gave" his mowers away....

As far as rules go, how is it any different than any other campground?? The Army Corp of Engineers won't let you park your car in the grass at the camping spot you PAID for. Seems to me like the Fairboard is asking that you pick up your stuff at the end of the season (wow, maybe you're related to my teenage daughter who thinks I'm asking for the world when I ask her to clean her room....). Isn't that what you should be doing anyway?

I saw a post on this exact thing in August as well. Seems like you (and others) expect improvements, additional ammenities, but think they should be FREE. Last I checked, staying @ the Embassy Suites cost more than staying at the Red Carpet.

Keep up the good work FireFindley, seems like you are looking long term for improvements at the both the campground and the fairgrounds.

I agree with turn your a/c off or pay for it, there are car washes in town, but you should be able to wash your camper a couple of times, they stay there for 6 months. As far as someone making the rules, not running the a/c has been in them before, just never enforced. The real problem with the rules, no one read them after they were written to see if they made sense.

You can laugh, but they are the same mowers, he sold them to the new business that got the contract.

As far as how is this campground different than others, we help support the best racetrack there is, Knoxville Raceway. We are there almost every weekend and sitting in the stands or suites. If we want to improve our spot we pay for the gravel or concrete. If we want a campfire at night, we have to supply our own fire ring, etc.

I also don't have a problem with paying more for camping, nothing is free.

I'm not to get into a pi$$ing match over this, but at times it gets very frustating when it seems everyone is not looking at the big picture. The more prople they have at the campground, should equal more people in the stands.

And the nicer they can make the campground, the more people that will camp there which means more people in the stands...

It costs $$$ to make improvements, and even with the fee increase that everyone keeps complaining about, it is still TREMENDOUSLY cheaper than camping at any other campground.

You get to park your camper for 6 MONTHS and never move it (so instead of driving your pick-up that gets 12 MPG, you drive your car that gets 30 the ENTIRE season)

You get 2 weeks at an Army Corp of Engineer Campground and you pay $15 per night EVERY NIGHT, not just the nights you are there staying in the camper. That's $465 / MONTH which would equate to $2790 for the 6 months you leave your camper at the North Campgrounds (but, you'd have to move it every 2 weeks as well, so you end up driving your gas hog vehicle every other weekend on top of the increased costs).

So, they are increasing your cost $100, that's $0.55 per day increase. If $0.55 per day means nicer restrooms/showers, better electricity hookups, better road maintenance, better fencing, better security, etc.. it seems well worth it to me (and I would think those camping there would really think so).

Yes, you do support the racetrack, but so do I (I just don't camp), the BIG picture is that the campground and the raceway are SEPERATE entities, take the RACETRACK away, and the campground DOESN'T exist. Heck, it didnt always exist, but the days of camping on the Fairgrounds are probably over for good (and IMO, it's not a bad thing, maybe you don't remember the days when campers were 18 inches apart across the entire Fairgrounds, those people weren't camping, they were packed in like sardines (and some smelled as bad )

I have a copy of the rules in a PDF if anyone wants a copy. Not sure if there is way to upload that on here somehow.

Eric

Eric Arnold
Social Media Manager & Track Historian
Knoxville Raceway

send me a copy when you get a chance, should be interesting reading...

Vande77,,we're on the same page. I agree the campground doesn't exsist without the racetrack, but the campground shouldn't be treated like a liability either. If 100 out of the 150 or so full time campers go to the races and 2 people out of each camper go that's 3000 dollars in the stands, $15.00 x 200 or more if they are in a suite. IMO, the campground is an asset, and should be treated as so.

Time will tell on what the improvements are, we can only hope for the best. Like I said I don't mind the increase, but I hope they do what they say they are going to do.

5 1/2 months till we get to do it again

And if your truck get 12 mpg,,can I borrow it,,LOL

I saw many improvements @ the Raceway this year that are a DIRECT result of firefindley and others on the Fairboard working on their days off from their regular job (just as an FYI - firefindley is a FULL-TIME fire fighter, he could be doing other things on his days off instead of working on improvements to the fairgrounds).

I don't doubt FireFindley when he states that work is being done and what that work is (why on earth would you put it out here in cyberspace for people to use against you if you don't get it done unless it WILL be done).

I think that PAST fairboards treated the campground as a liability (it probably in all reality isn't making any $$$, so it still is a libability). I think the current fairboard make-up knows that everything (the Fair, the Raceway events (including "regular" races), the campground, the storage facilities, etc..) have to be a revenue stream for the long term. Unless changes happen NOW (like the upgrades to the restrooms at the track, the upgrades they are laying out there for the North Campground), the long term prognosis is not good (you can't wait until it's junk or everyone has left to make changes, you have to be "constantly improving" or you're actually going backwards in relation to your competition.

My hats of to FireFindley, they need more of his kind on the board. Have you ever camped at the N. Campground??

We have complained about several things and nothing has changed. We went to Cappy, board members and it is what it is. The bathrooms were better this year, but only since they changed who was doing it. Before you really didn't want to go in there,,thought the close camping was bad!!

As far as not making any money out there,, 150 full time @$500, 350 or so for the Nationals @$140 plus paying for extra nights is over $120,000 for a season. Plus the money that comes into the stands from the campground This is rough since there are 600 spots to camp in.

message sent

$120,000 in REVENUE - do you know what the electric bill is for the campground? Let's say it averages @ $1200 a month, that's $14,400, what about mowing - let's say snow removal / mowing costs $300/ week = $15,600, Water - it's probably at LEAST what the electric bill is = $14,400, Insurance?? - let's lowball it and say $400/month - (most peoples house insurance is less than $100 per month, but we don't have anywhere CLOSE to the liability that the fairboard does with a campground) = $6000. Payroll for (1) part-time employee 15 hours a week year round @ $10 per hour would be $7800 plus payroll taxes, etc.. I'm already up to $58,200 and I haven't even started on taxes (property taxes for example, I'd say that that parcel of land if probably valued at $500,000 or more, in Marion Country that'd be another $10,000 or so in property taxes (the campground IS NOT county land, it is property that is OWNED by the Marion County Fair Association, therefore it is taxable). Income taxes - since the Marion County Fair Association is a FOR PROFIT BUSINESS, they have to pay income taxes as well, let's figure Sam and the State of Iowa gets around $10,000 total (from the campground), all of a sudden I'm already up to amost $80,000 and I lowballed some of my estimates and I'm sure there are other expenses that I am not even thinking of.

The bottom line is that just becuase people THINK they are making $$$ doesn't mean they are. I'm sure they have more expenses that I'm not even thinking of that are ONLY related to the North Campground (including electrical maintenance, water/sewer maintenance, security expenses (yes, they have to PAY to have security for the campgrounds, it's private property).

I hear people talk all the time about how the racetrack is making money hand over fist because they only look at what tickets cost and how much is spent in purse $$$, they seem to forget that they are no different than any other BUSINESS, they have other expenses that come out of that $$$ as well.

I looked at the Campground Rules that everyone is so "up in arms" about, if anything it's LESS RESTRICTIVE, at most campgrounds you wouldn't be able to have a "brick patio" or leave your camper sit for 6 months at a time.

So, if you don't move it yourself they are going to charge you $25 and storage fees (that's better than the state considering it abandoned and selling it off to the highest bidder).

You can't have an outdoor BUILDING, Refridgerator or Freezer (how's that different than any other campground?).

No watering lawn, washing vehicles or campers (you can't do this at other campgrounds either (most don't have water hook-ups to ENSURE that you don't).

You have to pick up after your pets and keep them on a leash (isn't that just common sense?)

Nothing reserved until PAID IN FULL (again, isn't that common sense?)

No electrical adapters to adapt from 30 amp to 50 or vice versa (seems like that's a good SAFETY call to me)

$20 per week for running your AC during the week (seems reasonable to me - it'd cost you $80 or month or more to run your AC non-stop at your house and your house has a LOT more insulation to keep the cool in than a camper does)

If you want the grass mowed around your trailer you need to unhook from power and move in slide-outs (again, seems reasonable, you'd be the first to complain if someone dinged your camper or ran over your power cord with a mower) - otherwise mow yourself on the weekend

No 100# LP cycliners (again, seems like a SAFETY call to me)

Removal of items (why wouldn't you take your things with you??)

dumping of items (again, seems like common sense to not leave your junk for someone else to dispose of)

Vande,,campground is open 6 1/2 months not 12 , they say they turn the electric off in the winter there is no snow removal for the campground, no employees in the winter,.. So even at your #'s that 40,000 profit.

Security for the campgrounds,,you've got to be kidding!!!!!!

I'm done with this.

they can turn the power off all they want, they still get a bill from Mid-American for the minimum charge (and the city for minimum water/sewer fee).

I'm also not claiming to know what their bills run, heck, their electric bill for just teh month of August could be $10,000 or more.

My entire point is that you can't use X # of campers time $X amount = how much money they make, you have to subtract out ALL of the expenses. It's the basic rules of business, your Revenue minus expenses = profit. If their revenues currently don't exceed their expenses, profit is currently $0.

Many of hte expenses I outlined exist whether the campground is open or not (last I checked they don't own their own power plant, or the city water department, or insurance company).

Confusing Revenue nad Profit on message boards seems to be a theme (the late model fans are convinced that Tony Stewart is clearing at least $800,000 on ticket sales alone during the World 100 (even though the place doesn't hold the # of people they claim are there and not all of them are adults paying full price).

I think you should lease the campground being that you know how to run it and make lots of money

Why let them make all that money