Forum: SCRAFAN.COM Forum (go)
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Trip,I read his post.With a steel head 360 ,running against 800hp 410's at perris,well let's just say a rude USAC official or not 'Grunk' would have a better time racing Victorville.What USAC should question is why Gardners brings 3 great cars/drivers,Seth Wilson comes,,Rip..ect and not just to the Faas /Gardner special events,their there on the regular almost no purse events.What need of the drivers/owners does Victorville fill that USAC fail to fufill..........by the way when I'm suited up ,earplugs,headsock ,helmet-I personally can't hear instructions well so I prefer that you raise your voice and I've mentioned that to a few track officials ,getting olds a bitch....I like a lot of the personnel USAC employs[Steve 'O',Mrs. Pratt,ect] my complaints are more to do with heavy handed back east management tactics.....changes at USAC? ..ASCS?...Faas /Gardner? something needs to change to get things moving in a positive direction.....I hope Calistoga goes well for fans and participants alike..

Its True I do have a Better Time at VictorVIlle, I need more seat time before I try to go "WAD" my car up at Perris... I just love the speed at the pas.... But not the money it takes to rebuild your car after a little crash... VictorVille is more "Car Friendly" if you will, Than P.A.S.. Besides I know I need more seat time..... P.S Shhhh I just got a Big 410 LOL.... And it wasnt about the YELLING from the officiall!!! no its not your age, We cant hear a thing with those helmets on...LOL.....

Everyone is a little Crazy in their own unique way...

Its the one's who Don't think they are Crazy you have
to Look Out For!!!!

Great post GRUNK! I agree with you 100%!! But its gotta come from the top. USAC has to be the ones who care. I just don't believe they do! Oh sure there a few individuals who work foe USAC that do. But for the most part, they don't. It's a damn shame too. Cause the PAS is as fime a facility for racing as there is in this country, it's just a shame that USAC has control over it.

OK KOP, there it is in a nutshell. You asked me to go after what's messed up the 410 deal and it's the PAS. I would have said it a long time ago but you guys woulden't get it and most still won't. Most of you guys know I've lived in both states and gone back and forth between the two for most of my life and I loved Ascot and I'm still having a love affair with Manzy. I'm glad you guys have the PAS after Ascot closed and maybe some day I'll get over to see it in person. It is a racy joint, no doubt about it. Manzy had to go along with the PAS if we wanted to continue to have 410 racing at Manzy during the year, not just have the Western or now the new Copper on dirt. We had no choice.

Now with what is happening the door is opening for another corporation to come in and that's ASCS. Now John I know you're a big supporter of ASCS and the fact that you have a friend that works for them and he's well respected in the Sprint car community means nothing to me. I'd like to see the Arizona Sprint Car Association and the California Racing Association take the show back and send USAC and ASCS packing!

CRA and SCRA had been the outlaws of the west coast and the sprint car world for a long time ... No wings, no USAC , just some of the best car owners and races anywhere. To me that's one of the things that was special about us compared to ANY group anywhere. I would love to see us take back our identity, we've seemed to have lost it.

Kenny

Half the lies they tell about me aren't true. 

I'll get back to ya on this. I agree with some of what you said. In the meantime, I got to go meet the crew to go work another race tonight. Have a good day!

I got it,but how about this spin....Shuman[SCRA president at the time] offered a contract to Manzy to be SCRA's home track...had they accepted perhaps all would be rosey in AZ...coulda..shoulda .woulda but....you represent Manzy as being sheep ,force to just get in line...well I suggest sheep is what they chose to be and now you want to complain because of the view[the brown hole of the sheep your following]PAS created their own situation,Manzy chose it's own path.As far as a west coast base orgainization working with the racetracks to put on sprint car races,I'm all for that....

I relate to what you guys are saying.I went to Barona with SCRA a number of years ago.I just showed up and when Ron Shuman saw me he went out of his way to come over and welcome me...I was a car he hadn't expected and he appreciated the increase in the car count.During qualifying my left front was bouncing ,Mr. shuman came over and had a look and we found a blown shock seal,he was concerned with my having the safest car possible to protect myself and the other competitors.That night [and most nights with SCRA] I felt welcomed and as if those there were ,as a group,looking out for one another....remember Ron Shuman was the SCRA president...while some of the officials at USAC are the same officials SCRA had and when I race with USAC I'm pleased to be welcomed by those nice people,I just don't get the same feeling of being part of USAC as I did Being a member of SCRA......If you choose to race with USAC ,keep in mind some of those in the white shirts/blue trim are like us,they infiltrated USAC just to help protect us from USAC's heavy handed actions.Be nice and respectful on a person basis and you'll be surprised ....

It's not about me or Manzy being willing to go along with the deal, not really. Like I've said before, I was a little kid in Torrance who remembers my Uncle with his big old camera flashing pictures at Carrell speedway and listening to stories about how the racing was after the war back at Indy where I was born.. I knew it was serious stuff, those Midgets, my dads friends were killed in em and that's why he got out. It wasn't till later over in Phoenix that it all started to come together and being able to sit in the big cars at the Phoenix fairground because my dad knew some of the guys is still etched in my mind. Manzy was going full bore in 57 and believe it or not Windy was the announcer.

I came back in 63 when I started high school and it was the CRA at Ascot and I was there till 74, talk about some exciting years and with the innovations and small blocks and then some big blocks or whatever they thought they could hang onto, it was the best. Looking forward to seeing how our boys stacked up to the big boys from USAC was always something everyone looked forward to, we where never let down.

You don't need to get so defencive and bad mouth Manzy's decision, but I knew some would and that's why I haven't posted anything about the deal. [the brown hole of the sheep your following] is just being a smart ass. The racers that grew up at Manzy have always been a big part of the show and you know it. You guys lose when it's not, hell man, we all lose. I don't represent anything except someone who has been around the CRA and Manzy their whole 60 years except a long fishing trip up into the pacific northwest.LOL

It's really simple why Manzy opted out. Even though the SC in SCRA stood for sprint car and not Southern California the majority of the cars were from there, it's a no brainer. I see us as on the same team, don't you?

Now if I was saying how I thought the best had come out of AZ and N.M. in the last 20 years, I could see you having a little spazz attack but not with what I posted..LOL

Kenny

Half the lies they tell about me aren't true. 

First off the sheep part was me being an smartass...but considering some of your previous post/pictures ,I thought you might find humour in the visual my words invoked...You stated it was Perris's fault.I just pointed out an option Manzy had ...I don't have enough info to know if Manzy made a good decision or not..... to answer your question "YES' we are on the same side,you obviously love sprint car racing and your passion shows in your writing,but that doesn't mean I agree with every thing you say...fair enough....you could'nt sucker me in to an arguement about the best driver..........ok. Cory Kruseman

Well from the fact that we didn't have many dates to begin with and now we have none. Also the fact that the attendance and car count over here has gone down from the beginning , tells me all I need to know. The Sprint car fans and owners in AZ have always had a big connection to CRA, SCRA and a lot of the guys that I've sat in the stands with for years were not happy, like myself, when USAC came to stay. Maybe because I like tradition, as do a lot of the die hard fans in both states. We're also a little old school and mavericks and we like traditional cars and we liked doing it our way.

For starters USAC snubbed tradition when they messed up the big cars and screwed up the gathering of the clan at the original Copper Classic. They have no heart or soul like we had with the old CRA or the SCRA. That's what we need to get back, that along with a little innovation of our own again. Look how much excitement the open comp race had at Victorville or the race this weekend at Calistoga. The race at Calistogo reminds a lot of guys of how it used to be and man I wish I could have gone. We need to bring back the innovation and excitement and opening up the outdated engine rule would be a good start. Give these young people a little bit of what we had and that might include taking some of the sheet metal off the cars so you can see the driver a little better. Get rid of those big nerf bars, it makes them look like the cars at the state fair and it encourages drivers to drive over their heads.

We don't need USAC to put people in the stands, never have. What we need is some good old CRA or whatever you want to call it, open comp racing. I know, what about when USAC comes to town, what then? LOL I don't have the answers, I just know what a lot of us like and what some newcomers would as well.. I wish you guys the best and you should know that. I'm a brother, always have been.

Kenny

Half the lies they tell about me aren't true. 

The Victorville races may have been the high point of the season for me.All the fans and participants had a positive attidude and everyone wanted nothing but for these two guys[FAAS/GARDNER]to succeed with their plan to put the fun back in sprint car racing....I personally scan the message board regularly,hoping to see 'Let's Go Racing ' one more time....wish someone would help finance some more fun events with faas/gardner at the helm! They brought a lot of people together for those events,That spells HOPE for the future of sprint cars in So. Ca.

Trust me, I could feel it all the way over here.

Half the lies they tell about me aren't true. 

I THINK IT WAS IN 1977, J.C. TURNED THE LIGHTS OFF AT ASCOT AND DIDNT TURN THEM BACK ON FOR OVER A YEAR.

WE HAD NO CHOICE BUT TO TRAVEL TO THE DIFFERENT TRACKS C.R.A. MANAGED TO SET UP FOR A SHOW.

SOME DIRT SOME ASPHALT.

WITH NO HOME TRACK THE FUN WAS GONE FOR US. I NEVER NEW WHY THIS HAPPEND,

I HEARD EVERY STORY THERE WAS

IM SURE IT HAD SOMETHING TO DO WITH THE LAND OWNER.

AMAZINGLY WHEN ASCOT RE OPEND; THE CAR COUNT CAME BACK.

I KNOW THINGS ARE TOUGH FOR EVERYBODY,

TEMPERS ARE FLYING AND ACCUSATIONS ARE GETTING OUT OF HAND.

THERE ARE MANY STRONG BUSINESS PEOPLE INVOLVED WITH U.S.A.C.

,PERRIS MANAGEMENT, CAR OWNERS AND DRIVERS.

YET I HAVENT HEARD OF ONE MEETING BETWEEN ANY OF THESE PEOPLE.

DURING THESE ROUGH TIMES THE CAR COUNT OR THE FAN BASE ISNT GOING TO GET TO MUCH STRONGER NO MATTER WHOS RUNNING THE SHOW.

I CAN SPEND ALL DAY DRIVING AROUND VISITING CAR OWNERS IVE KNOWN THROUGH THE PAST 35 YEARS AND ALL HAVE A DIFFERENT REASON WHY THERE CARS ARE SITTING IN THE GARAGE.

I HOPE THINGS GET BETTER SOON FOR EVERYBODY,

I WOULDNT WANT TO LOOSE A FACILITY LIKE PERRIS TO ANOTHER TYPE OF RACING,

"while some of the officials at USAC are the same officials SCRA had"

DT: I don't profess to know the entire USAC/CRA official roster but best as I can recall, only Robert Mayson (awesome PR rep) and Evelyn Pratt (my all time favorite bull horn blower lol) were former SCRA officials now working with USAC/CRA. Freddie Sachs (who is like the best damn scorer ever), was the SCRA scorer. I'm not sure if he is still scoring as I thought he had left that post by now. Maybe someone can attest to that, not sure. Any way, other than those 3, there aren't any former SCRA officials working on the current officiating crew. Just FYI

Your somewhat right about Manzy's choice to follow what the PAS was doing. Afterall, most of the teams were California based and asking them to travel to Manzy too many times would have been a hardship.

As for the ASCS comment you made, sure I think highly of Emmett Hahn and what he has done with his company. He has built that company from the ground up. He and I had an interesting chat about west coast 410 racing while we were on the Sprint Bandit tour. I need to keep my conversation with him under wraps (he wasn't sharing info with me to broadcast openly), but what was discussed was quite interesting. For the record, as much as I totally respect Emmett and all he has accomplished, as for west coast 410 racing, I would rather see the car owners reform their own association (as you do). I just don't know if any of the current car owners feel they can do that without total confidence they could make such a transition smoothly.

Now, if there is to be a choice of USAC vs. ASCS and that's the 2 options to decide from, then I would be a voter for ASCS. I just feel they would be more effective in running such a series from top to bottom.

Why is it that the same old name's that have NOTHING to do with the current CRA (KOP) and names that have raced a few times and run at the back (they know who they are) are always stirring up crap? It is never the drivers and car owners that fully support the show, it is never the crew members etc. that show up week after week and work for nothing because they love the sport. And by the way Joe's dad (who is a nice guy and has been around for a long time) there has been many meetings with the car owners and promotors. How about we ignore the sour grapes that have been posting nothing but crap since USAC has been the sanctioning body and be positive and make it work. I think Shu did an excellent job but while he was in charge all the guys that were running in the back of the pack AND NOT CURRENTLY INVOLVED with the sport bad mouthed him and made his job a headache. And those are the EXACT same people that bad mouthed Frank Lewis and pushed for "new" are now are still talking crap about the Shu. Now we have them and a new batch talking crap about USAC, and this is after USAC hired in a new crew from within the CRA circle. Does all this current bashing just boil down to not enough excitiement in someone's life and they need to stir up the pot? I say get off the crapper and do something positive for the sport, buy a pit pass and help out a team that is underfunded, bring a friend to the races, help pay a tire bill at the So-Cal trailer, there is a ton of things that can help the sport and you will fell much better than tearing up what so many people have worked so hard for over the last 50+ years.

Being the new kid on the block so to speak here in So Cal open wheel racing (east coast transplant) arriving only a few years ago(but a racing fan for over 40 yrs) I really do not know what is going on behind the scenes as you veteran posters do on this site I am a P.A.S. regular since arriving but I know what I am seeing... and what a great facility this place is.. and in the past have seen some awesome racing also know the car counts are falling off sharply and it sounds like from your postings USAC has a lot to do with it..In my experience over the years of racing big ruling bodies are not always better you just become a number and it is big business such as that thing they call NASCAR...what good is it having USAC involved if they are not helping with purse and point money? my understanding is our present champ got the shaft last year at seasons end this is not right these guys put their hearts and souls into it and their butts on the line doing what they love ...I do not have the answers only know I would hate to think what could happen to the best and most exciting racing bar none there is at our local tracks here in CA and AZ..promoters wake up lets talk ....to quote something I saw yesterday on a racing site that says it all..........There are but two sports, auto racing and bullfighting, everything else is just a game! Hemingway 1933.............thanks everyone for all the info I am learning from your postings.......

You made some good points and the call to help teams is always a good thing. I have (and do) help out racers when I can. It isn't true that owners and drivers don't come on here and express their concerns and unhappiness (there is one on this thread if fact). Other than when Tony Jones chimmed in on the 2007 point fund, you just don't see the bigger marquee names comment on these boards (unless they use a nic of course ).

I see by your posts on this board that you have been around the block and are a fan of the sport as we are. Buying tires, pit passes and the like (while a good thing) isn't going to fix the bigger problem at hand (but do it people). Like the car owner I referenced said, other than going to the next race on the schedule, there doesn't seem to be a plan. There needs to be one wouldn't you agree?

Sorry you feel that myself and others aren't always expressing ourselves in the light you would like. We all post pluses and minuses. It's just that the current management has provided a lot of minuses to address.

"There are but two sports, auto racing and bullfighting, everything else is just a game! Hemingway 1933".

That's interesting..My dad always said back in the day that the bull riders and the open wheel guys were both crazy....LOL

Half the lies they tell about me aren't true. 

Welcome new kid, glad to have you on board. To retain your right to post here, mail your $100 USAC message board license fee to:

USAC Board of Directors

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EZ Burgie, it's just a joke LOL