Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I'm not sure if the weight rule has saved teams any money, but it may have saved some lives and has leveled the playing field a bit.

Funny story about that trapdoor when DW was the guest on Dale Jr. Download.  When Darryl went to drop a little bit of shot out of the frame, the trapdoor stuck open, dropped all of the shot out, and spun out Dave Marcus who was running right behind them.  They held Dave Marcus on pit road looking for a trapdoor on his car thinking he spun himself out.  When they found nothing, they waited for DW after the race.  Well, DW won the race, and during his victory lane celebration, Nascar officials jacked the car up, crawled underneath, and started inspecting.  DW was looking on nervously, but he said they put the jack right over the trapdoor hole on the car, and after looking under the entire car, they crawled out, dropped the jack, and walked away. 

As far as "egras", my nickname is Sarge----so it's just sarge backwards. 

Absolutely.  It was less about money.  Some guys were drilling holes in their aluminum seats and wheels to save weight it got out of hand for sure.  

You would also have consider tire wear into that, the difference in weight of a new tire versus a completly worn out tire just the RR is about 25 to 30lbs. and you still got the difference in the LR and the Rf. Your car also loses water in the radiator during a race, so theres another loss in weight and thats not always consistant, depends on how hot the weather is.

For some its impossible to do so due to how much the driver weighs. For some of the drivers, there is only so much weight that you can cut with light weight materials like wings, body panels, tail tanks, seats, etc but when the driver sits in the car, its not going to be close to being light. Other thing is sometimes, a little extra weight may help improve the cars handling depending on the track, track conditions, and shape. 

Finally, I always thought the cars were technically weighed before and after the race considering I think they weigh themselves after their qualifying laps. While I'm sure the teams play with the weights for the car, I don't think many teams are as close as what some people think they are. I usually sit outside of turn 4 across the scale at Eldora and it shows the number as the drivers go across. I cannot think of a time where any driver has come anywhere close to not making weight. I am usually more shocked at how much over each car is when they go across the scales. Last year during the LETS RACE RACE TWO weekend I remember all 3 cars being closer to 1500lbs vs 1400lbs

I seem to remember folks talking about Donny's car weighing in over 1600 lbs (or maybe upwards of 1600 lbs) after a race he won a few years back.  Anyone else remember this? 

     I dunno. I'm having a hard time visualizing how to carry a gallon of water in a sprint car in such a manner that it can be jettisoned at a later point. I did a bunch of math concerning 1-3/8" and 1-1/2" tubes with .095 and .083 wall thickness and such to try to figure out how much water you could conceivably hide in the chassis. That theory went sideways pretty quickly. Each tube would be it's own water container because the tubes aren't put together like plumbing pipes. I also can't picture how you could have the needed filler and emptier plugs and associated mechanics to make it work without it being really obvious.

I read that article. It was a fun read. I wonder how much of that was truth and how much was embellished legend? In an event, hiding buckshot in an old NASCAR racer with the big ol' 3"x6" (?) frame rails had a lot more places to hide tricks than a modern sprint car which is built pretty sparsley. 

OK Sarge. I had a screen name of Murphy Siding on a railroad forum. I shortened it to Murphy because it's easy to remember. Trying to remember yhprum every time I sign in would probably mess me up.

That reminds me of a quote from Joey Saldana, back when they first introduced minium weight rules. He said something along the lines of "Steve Kinser weighs probably 50-75# more than a lot of us other drivers, and he's kicking our butts. Now you want us to add weight our cars?"

Now we are weighing the whole field instead of the top 3 to 5 nobody cares how much you weigh if you finish outside of the top 5.  It is like throwing the checkered flag and then the next lap thowin the green! Weighing the whole field is a waste of time.

Let's go Sprint Car Racing!

Rico - 9 wins
Donny - 0 wins That is right the big fat zero!

Knoxville - Best Track In the USA!
Eldora - 2nd Best Track in the USA!

This is the reason they have to keep the weighing after the feature!  If you are under after the feature you get last place it is not that hard.

Let's go Sprint Car Racing!

Rico - 9 wins
Donny - 0 wins That is right the big fat zero!

Knoxville - Best Track In the USA!
Eldora - 2nd Best Track in the USA!

They weigh the entire field at every WoO race I've attended since the inception of weight rules. Weighing them before the feature instead of just right after qualifying is not that big of a stretch.

I see your point, but wouldn't it just be a matter of accounting for those other weight issues? Add areasonable weight in for tire wear, and water & oil loss and go from there?

Does a modern sprint car engine carry a lot of oil? There was a time when an engine would start to blow blue smoke and shortly thereafter turn into a pop! and a quick fireball. Now, it seems like a car can spray for mosquitos in the corners for lots of laps. 

I'm with Strawser on this it's the best way to do it. We already have work areas, blending rules and more delays than we've ever had at these shows. Does anyone remember pre weight rules? How about the 1200 lb Nationals? I remember teams complaining about it because they we're doing everything to save weight including exotic metals it was a safety issue and a cost issue. Yes I know titanium is still here but who knows where it would be 25 years later. Racers are always looking for the edge remember the stories about aluminum frames back in the 70s. Guys are always gonna play games remember the Reutzal deal a few years ago? 

Your analysis is spot on.

Surely there's a possibility of adding a little time, but you'd also be subtracting some time at the end, as you wait for three cars to clear the scales before the winner is officially announced. Maybe they could do it during the 20 minutes they spend farming the track before the A-main?

On a side note, do the cars have to weigh 1425# after time trials?

I think it has way more to do with safety than costs but that's just my opinion. No more drilling out the centers of every bolt, no more thin tubing, etc

Absolutely. But it happens. Scales everywhere are different, boil some water out of the radiator, burn off some oil in the engine or rear end, tires start to come apart, etc. There is chance of error. I'd probably scale before the night starts at that track if I knew I was cutting it close already and adjust accordingly.

That's 1425# with the driver. That is where I see the advantage. You have a Bigger guy like Kinser vs. a Horse Jockey size driver like Sheldon or Rico. I would assume those smaller drivers probably have to add weight to the car and having the option to add weight to the car where you choose to better suit the dynamics or balance of the car would be a lot more of an advantage than being restricted to having all of that weight in the drivers seat..  I mean (sorry to keep using Kinser) but Steve probably weighed 190-200# when he was in fit shape. Haud , Larson or Rico I'm guessing 150-175# - Thats 25,30 maybe 40 lbs. to play with... Thay's enormous in Sprint car weight.

That's 1425# with the driver. That is where I see the advantage. You have a Bigger guy like Kinser vs. a Horse Jockey size driver like Sheldon or Rico. I would assume those smaller drivers probably have to add weight to the car and having the option to add weight to the car where you choose to better suit the dynamics or balance of the car would be a lot more of an advantage than being restricted to having all of that weight in the drivers seat..  I mean (sorry to keep using Kinser) but Steve probably weighed 190-200# when he was in fit shape. Haud , Larson or Rico I'm guessing 150-175# - Thats 25,30 maybe 40 lbs. to play with... Thay's enormous in Sprint car weight.