Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

KOP

I would want the "professionals" to help, not someone getting in the way, even if they have good intentions.

This whole thread is classless and sorry I'm adding to it, but I wanted to answer your question.

after watching the video several times it looks like to me that Tracy bailed from a burning car and immediately was on his way to help johnny, but he sees johnny is already getting out of his car and the fire crue was right on top of the situation, i think Tracy without a doubt did the right thing and if he was needed he was ready to jump in, to me anyone that feels differently is twisted

Robert Bond    San Jose Ca

Well Shrek, call me twisted then. Yes, Tracy bailed out the way he did because he thought he was possibly on fire. However, he does realise very quickly that he is OK and then begins to walk calmly away from his car.

You say you watched the video several times. How would you explain that as Johnny is rolling in the fire laden fuel that a guy with NO PROTECTION (short sleeves shirt at that) comes from the right (off camera even) and gets to Johnny and pulls him from the burning fuel while Tracy (who was closer) just stands and watches?

Fire is a drivers worst fear. In all the years of attending races, I've seen several drives assist their fellow man in such situations. It didn't happen in this case.

Calmly? Now you also know exactly how he was feeling at the time this happened? It might surprise you to learn that not everyone runs around like a shrieking raving panicked moron during times of crisis. I imagine that anyone watching me react to emergencies would accuse me of being calm and uncaring as well - that's just how some of us are wired. The emotions and the panic don't come until later, after the situation has been resolved.

I have shown this clip to my entire family (3 generations of firefighters and a couple of first response EMTs), and not one person has voiced this opinion about Hines that you are beating like a dead horse here, KOP. Professional firefighters would much rather see the bystanders do just that - STAND BY.

Why don't you just go ahead and tell us what your real problem is with Tracy and why you are on such a mission to make him look bad? I don't know the guy, but I can't help but defend him against such a ridiculous character attack.

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Amen Duchess.........This thread didn't need to happen. Talk about "classless".....Thoughts like those expressed here need to be kept private. Innocent topic with some very wrong motives evidently.

Some of you may remember, but Tracy Hines was burned in a midget crash at Richmond years ago. I was at the event, and I believe it was part of a Silver Crown/Midget double header. There was a multi-car crash on the backstretch, and one of the cars had a ruptured fuel cell. Hines was in the middle of the crash and had to bail out of the car. However, he received some burns on his face, hands and feet in the process.

It appeared when Heydenreich's car backed into the fence it crushed the fuel cell and fuel sprayed all over the car and track. It reminded me if the Todd Shafer's fire in Florida a while back. The fuel just sprayed into the cockpit. However, Silver Crown cars carry alot more fuel.

I believe Hines bailed out of his car because he thought he was on fire again. I don't beleive he would have taken a header like that if he just wanted to fight Johnny. Also, if his suit had fuel splashed on it too he would have gone up like a shop rag. Then the safety crew would have had to put both drivers out. Perhaps that's why he didn't jump into the fire. Honestly, I do not believe it is fair to crucify a guy on a message board. No one knows what was going through his mind at the time.

The picture in the Speed Sport News shows the car on fire, Johnny laying on the track, and the safety workers doing there job.

What a great evaluation...no one knows what was going thru his mind at the time. The most important thing is, everybody survived.

Fenders are like vacuums... they both suck.

I'll say this kinda reminds me of an incident at Devils Bowl WInter Nationals this year when a newcomer----Donnie Ray Crawford------caught on fire and went into the pits in turn 1. There is a video on Darin Short's website of it. In that video yuo will see a bunch of people just standin around while Crawford is trying to put the fire out by rolling. From being there and seeing the reaction in the pits there was about 10 seconds betwen when he caught on fire and when he stopped in the pits. And after he stopped many stilldidn't come to help. Although right before the safety crew got there a street stock driver tried to help. Maybe its just an instinctive reaction for some to help and others just be astonished. I see some of ya'll points though, Hines probably did think he was on fire but still, if he knew that guy caught fire why was he still walkin over there all pissed off?

this one could go either way.

How much would could a wouldchuck chuck if a 
wouldchuck could chuck would

Even if Tracy wanted to fight...there is no way he jumps out of a car head first when its still moving to go after someone. He's also not going to unbuckle seconds after hitting the wall to go fight when he knows there is a chance other cars could still pile in.

Its obvious to me he was in an accident where he was in the middle of a big fire ball which I'm sure was hot...he thought he could be on fire so he bailed asap. He started walking over there then the safety people were there. There was nothing for him to do.

Also, after being in a bad fire in the past....I'm sure Hines was a little freaked out from the deal. Most drivers handle flips like they happen everyday but fire is a litte different.

 I don't have a dogin this fight so I'm not picking sides. I see points both good and bad. I looked at the video and also saw the picture in the Speed Sport News. KOP does point out some interesting facts.

Hines did calm down quickly when he stood up after bailing out of the car. Not an action a driver would have taken if he were still in trouble. The fire crew was there quickly but as KOP pointed out, it was someone who came from out of the video frame to finaly get to Johnny and pull him from the fire. He was the person that was the furthest away of all parties to do so. If you look at the video, the fire crew sprays the fire, but interesting enough, they don't attempt to get Johnny out of the fire. As for the guy in the NSSN pic that got there, you can see it is a track official by the lettering on his back. It is obvious he isn't one of the fire team members. Fire crews are always in their fire suits, not short sleeve shirts.

In looking at both the video and the pic in NSSN, I can see why someone would wonder why Hines didn't try to help when he was closer than the guy who finally did get to him. I am surprised that any driver would be that close with an attempt to assist and watch a fellow driver possibly burn. I also see points made for not interfering with the professionals. In this particular incident, a fellow driver chose not to assist. That was his call right or wrong. The way Hines has his hands on his hips in a relaxing type stance just made  it look bad I guess. Lets all be thankful that Johnny wasn't hurt more than he was, that's the main thing.

Yenko427.......as far as i'm concerned you nail it down better than anyone else....my son has helped Johnny a few times,so it was very disturbing to see this clip....IMO....the excellent response to the fire by the fire crew should be on the hot box....yes the fire has to be put out,but i hope to HECK the next time they figure out the DRIVER is more important than the fire exterminating....it took little effort to pull him out of it.....and i truely hope someone gives that track worker a very deserving thank you....not wanting to crusify the fire workers here,as they did a very good job of fighting it....but they did drop the ball.....thank God the track official had his head on right....how long would they have let him lay in the fire?....until the got it out?....sure looked that way....life's short,play hard.

instead of reading through everything else just look at yenko427 and sprint2257's post, it sums up the crash and everyhting else.

To me it's apparent that Hines came out of his car sorta pissed. I agree with an earlier post that the very least he could've done was grab him by the ankles and drag him away from the fire..

This whole thread just needs to go away....PERIOD!

But your post just brought it back to the top of the page again  

any driver that wrecks usually gets out of the car pissed

I can help to answer the question about Tracy's intentions. Soon after the incident happened and Johnny was placed in the ambulance, we were getting ready to head to the hospital. We still had absolutely no idea of Johnny's condition. I was pretty shaken because it wasn't looking good. The fire was the worst that I had witnessed, and Johnny got caught up in a second fireball when he inadvertently rolled in his own methanol pool.

Tracy Hines came running out of nowhere and verbally attacked me ... screaming about his race car. He never asked about Johnny...just screamed about his ruined race car. Needless to say I was in shock and dumbfounded. My mouth dropped open about a mile, and my response was "Tracy, I'm not going to talk to you about this now", and then I turned and walked away.

I've seen classless individuals, but this one is at the top of the list.

Luckily Johnny was not seriously hurt in the incident, so I am very thankful for that. His safety equipment and the fire crew at the track did their job. The person who pulled him out of the fire was one of the officials at the track, and he indeed was wearing absolutely NO fire protection -- just a short sleeve shirt and no gloves. That man is a hero in my opinion.

Sharon Bank, BigCar #90

Hines took a header out of his car because he was obviously hot from the fire. Was he mad quite possibly. Did this have an impact on his reaction to the fire, probably not. Could he have helped? Possibly. Was it as easy as you say it was? No. The fire crew was there, did they have the situation under control. No. Have there been drivers who have gone into fires to help others out? Yes, and they should be thanked. But at many of these occasions they were people who didn't help and I don't see anybody crucifying them.

Why should Tracy risk his own life/well being when there are trained proffesionals on the scene? He has a family he is responsible for. Would you have risked your own life? Maybe - Maybe not. You will never know until a moment like that happens. There should never be blame placed on a driver for not helping another. Until you personally are in a situation like Hines was you have no place to judge him. And if you have then you know like me that you still don't blame him. I've seen many of fires that "trained" firefighters have gone into to help someone and not make it back out.

I was at the track and have my own photos and personal knowledge of what happened. Tracy was sprayed with the fuel and drove through the fire. To run into flames again would set himself on fire. That would have given the crew two burning drivers to deal with. Staying away from flames was the smart thing to do. By the time it appeared that the fire crew was not going to pull Johnny out an official was all ready there and did it. Tracy would not have gotten him out any faster. Tracy did come back and check on Johnny who was conscious and telling them not to cut his driving suit off so he knew Johnny wasn't seriously hurt. These are only my opinions but I was there. Also ask Sharon Bank what Tracy was mad about. I was there for that argument also. Tracy did not blame Johnny for the wreck.

Larrie Ervin

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