Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
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What is rule for the outlaws racing at a track on a night they are off?

Is it the same for the WoO late models?

Thanks, Richard

in before because I saw insert name of driver here at insert name of track here just last week omg that's terrible

World of Outlaws Platinum members can't race at ANY track that doesn't host a World of Outlaws Sprint Series event at some point during the season, and can't race at a track that DOES host an event within 7 days of that event (unless granted special permission).

I am assuming the ASCOC races in Florida don't apply because they are technically before the WoO season starts?

That is correct.  

Then they should not be called "Outlaws" anymore. WoO has totaly abandoned the concept that they were started with.  WoO is now what USAC was when the WoO was started. Sad state of afairs.

The Outlaws consistenly run for the most money of anyone.   Wasn't the Outlaws started chasing the most money available.   Just because the way races are organized have changed does not make them not doing the same thing that they did when they started.   They are going for the biggest paychecks that they can.

Johnny when the Outlaws race in PA I see 4 Provisoinals 2 Outlaws 2 Possee whys that ? Will the NSL get two?

They started as "we are going to come to your track, run your rules and your format and still  kick your butts & take your money". Now it is " we are going to come to your track, make you run our rules & format and see if you can  beat us"

They were also made to get away from all of USAC's rules about needing to be a member to race and only racing when & where USAC said you could.

I doubt that when the Outlaws was first started that any of the folks involved could have possibly imagined that it would still be going strong so many years later. Unfortunatley without new rules and policies put in place it would have folded long ago. The present state of the Outlaws is a product of the WRG, the drivers/owners, tracks and fans. These rules were developed over a period of time to keep the Outlaws on the road and make it a profitable venture for most of the folks involved. If Outlaw drivers were able to race wherever and whenever it would make "The Outlaws" less of a draw when they came to town. I mean if I could go see 6 out of the 13 Outlaw drivers at a local track on a Fri night nonsanctioned event for $12 why would I pay $35 when all 13 come the following week for the sanctioned shows? Yes it would benefit the fans but It would end up costing the the Outlaws (drivers, owners, tracks, and yes the WRG).  When these teams sign up to go on tour with the Outlaws they are well aware of rules and restrictions that go along with being a full time touring Woo member.  It dosnt matter if we agree or disagree with the rules, they were put in place to protect everyone involved.  Dont get caught up on the word Outlaw, yes at one point in time it refered to a group of drivers that didnt race at anyone track and chased the big money across the country, Now the Outlaws still dont race at any one track and they still go after the big money across the country, only difference is now they are big enough to put on the show and put up the big money and a local can come take the money from the Outlaws. 

Forgive my stupidity, you compared the Outlaws with USAC, was there a time when USAC ran wings?  You stated that one of the reasons the Outlaws were started was to get away from USAC's rules. Im not being sarcastic, I just dont understand how a winged Outlaw series was the solution to the rule heavey non winged USAC series.

They aren't called "Outlaws", They are called "The World of Outlaws"! It's a Trademarked name of an Organization that Hosts a dozen or so of the baddest Sprint Car Drivers in the Country. If it were not for this Organization or other Organizations like the National Sprint Car League or the AllStars, Then these fine young drivers would have to revert to what you refer as a "True Outlaw", Go out on their own, come to our Racetracks kick our local drivers asses and take their money. 

Nobody has abandoned the concept.. Things are just different!

Actually True Outlaws rode into town on Horses and Robbed Banks & Trains but that's long gone as well.

See ya at the Races...

What's sad about it?  If a driver does not want to be a WoO regular they are free to participate in their shows whenever and wherever they want without having to adhere to the policies that full time travelers do.

Think for a minute about the advantage the WoO sanction would give you if you promoted a track.  You would be guaranteed that member drivers were going to show and could proceed to book radio and television spots to promote the race.  For the most part rules are uniform in 410 racing and that makes those huge car counts at the Knoxville Nationals possible.  We can thank the Outlaws for that as well. 

I remember sitting in the stands as a kid in the early 60's and being devastated because my favorite driver chose to go elsewhere.  To illustrate the rules in those days my relatives bought the former Wagner #63 IMCA car that Richert and Daniels drove and ran it as a caged Supermodified without a wing, a caged winged Supermodified (both with fuel injection) and with a Speedway Motors body and alchohol carburator.  We're not talking criss crossing the country, they raced in central and southern Minnesota, Iowa, South Dakota and Wisconsin and had to change the car whenever they left the local tracks and hauled a few hundred miles.  The end of the Outlaws would open the door to return to that kind of rules hodge podge.  The World of Outlaws are the glues that holds everyone together rules wise.

As far the Outlaws name, it was born in the late 70's during the heyday of the "Outlaw" country popularity.  The name conjured up thoughs of those types of free spirits.  Things have changed since 1978, I am a helluva lot older, slower and fatter but I'm getting off subject.  Seriously, the World of Outlaws brand has the history and name recognition.  True that the barnstorming concept that produced that name is no more but let's face it even drivers who run a pick and chose schedule operate are more disciplined.  Refer to Open Wheel archives and exploits of the barnstormers of the 70's pre WoO days.  You'll look long and hard to find anyone sleeping in the back of a pickup and particpating in drunken motel antics today.  The cost of running one of these cars and the necessity of obtaining and keeping sponsors necessitates a higher standard of behavior than was required in the days you're romanticising.

Geez due, I'm gonna be 64 this fall and people call me a dinosaur but if you can't see these obvious changes over the past 50 years you're more of a reptilian than I am. 

Stan Meissner

there was a time when usac ran some wing shows...into the early 90s i believe and the outlaws ran non wings shows until the late 80s

Well said, Stan.  I remember when the Outlaws started coming to Knoxville.  Things have not changed all that much.  It's just more formalized now that it was then.  Don't know if the drivers had a contract with Ted Johnson back then, but he would have raised hell if they missed a show to run somewhere else.

Hey dummy, the WoO started out as non wing. The first WoO race winning car is in the museum at Knoxville with out a wing. They did not go full winged for several years.

Yes he did but someone with first hand knowledge will have to fill in the details.  Didn't have a need to know so I didn't pay attention to details.

Stan Meissner

A local track promoter has the option of starting as many provisionals as the WoO.  Those provisionals are based on track points at a weekly venue.  So Knoxville Raceway, Huset's Speedway, etc. has that option, but a series like the NSL, All Stars, MOWA or IRA does not.  It is up to the promoter whether they want to pay those provisionals.

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I like Stan went to a lot of midwest Sprint and Super Modified races in the 60's. Most Sprint races in the midwest(IA, NE, MO, MN) were IMCA and most were at state fairgrounds. Some tracks ran as super modifieds and were sprints with different tails or body parts, and bolt on cage, and some cars built as strait out supers. During the 1970's there became more factory built frames and bodies for sprint cars and thus more sprint cars, more racers and races.

In the 60's and 70's most "outlaws" were better racers that came in from outside the normal racing area to compete.

Even before the WOO they called racers like Dick Gaines, Bubby Jones, Jan Opperman, Kenny Weld outlaws. Mainly teams that had the confidence to travel to a well paying race outside their area and compete.

I think some of the emphasis for organization in the 1970's on a national level was to "quantify" races as having well known drivers due to the fact there was beginning to be more races.

With USAC you knew the entrants if you followed the organization.

In the mid-west there were well paying great shows with many good cars and drivers before the WOO came about such as the Nationals, races at IA, MO, MN, NE, State fairgrounds, as well as Spencer, Tulsa and Oklahoma City and Cheaters Day in SD.

If I  remember correctly,  being at the USAC-WOO Dream Event in Springfield(1982) when word came of the bad accident at Knoxville. Soon after that wings were run at Knoxville and WOO events.

Take away Schatz and the rest of the field is not any better than the regular Knoxville regulars.With the addition of NSL I would guess guys like Brown,Lasoski,McCarl,will have a better bottom line at the end of the year as supporting a team that travels from Penn to California.The thing WOO has above the others is the name and announcer plus the involvement of at least 3 Sprint Cup drivers.The rules have made the playing field as even as it has ever been.TV coverage isnt a factor like Sprint Cup[ no matter how boring it can be].Events like the Chili Bowl draw good audiences but it just doesnt seem to work otherwise..Golf and tennis are more boring than the first 450 miles of a Sprint race but must have sponser appeal.