Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Don't blame the World of Outlaws and Williams Grove Speedway...bad races are going to happen

I blame myself for thinking that the Cow Palace would pay attention to the details that the fans really care about...

I don't mind spending the money near as much as wasting my time...

Opinions may vary...

I don't know squat about track prep but I'm sure they did their best considering conditions. Some people always want to blame someone

Hell, any sporting event can be a yawner if one side dominates. Super Bowl was crap unless you were a Seahawk fan....

one last questions, what system adds more wear on the race track, Multi Car Qualifying or 1 car at a time ?

Dont Get me Wrong, I Like Watching Time Trials, But ONLY 1 Car at a Time, as A Videographer its Very Hard to Video 4 & 5 Cars on the track at the Same time, It also Takes Away the announcer mentioning all the drivers in groups, sponsors, chassis, engine builder, ect ect ect

I Lost complete interest in Time Trials after series went to 4 and 5 cars on the track at a time time trialing, it just looks like there out there practicing, TOTALLY Takes away the enjoyment of watching time trials, now i go do something else while Time Trials are on

The Main reason i say get rid of the time trials & the dash, it just adds more laps on the track & come feature time theres no race track left to race on? Maybe i'm wrong maybe if they did away with those added laps on the track, the end results would be the same

One last thing THE FAST CARS Should never start on the front row, The Dash Race Basically Decides the Feature Winner in most cases

I still say lineup the feature Races by Handi Cap, the last 3 races Money Won, 

& To make the Heat races MEAN SOMETHING, Give 1st 5 Points & 2nd 3 Points & 3rd 1 Point, that would Make the drivers Race in there Heat Races

I Really only like giving out points for features only, Id rather just give the top 5 points, 1st=5 2nd=4 3rd=3 4th=2 5th=1 Would save alot of time addeding points up

Maybe the other  guys

are right no matter what you try the cars are to Equal now days and the FIX is in the cars

Ive gone to 60 plus races a year on the west coast for the past twenty years and myself and another race fan were talking about this very thing the other day and we honestly figured that 1 out of 20 heats are worth watching and the dashes no better.  Mains are mostly dominated by the first two rows 8 out of ten times as well.  Races worth remembering we guess one or two a year, honestly if you truly look at it objectively the remembered races are few and far between.  

Im going to say that it seems year after year Trophy Cup is maybe the most consistently great race every year.  You know when you go youll see some great racing.  Just saying...................

CAJ

Lincoln and New Egypt had good track prep, Williams Grove and Orange County, not so much...

Opinions may vary...

I don't mind seeing a car win from the front row as long as said driver is picking through lapped traffic and actually trying to hold someone off. As far as the Grove Friday I figured hey lucky to get the show in due to the weather, but Saturday...well what was the deal there. These tracks have shows every week with the same guys out there minus the outlaws and it is great racing start to finish for the most part. When the track is dusting up before TT's are over it's a track prep issue. You can go to a show running 305's, 358's and 410's and the track isn't a one groove rubber down pos for the a main. I don't think running hot laps and heats for three classes kills the track any less than TT's heats and the dash.

How can you handicap Outlaw races? If you go to a three-race deal, I mean, when they go to most regions, guys don't run three races in a row. They are at a track one night in Ohio, how do you put those regulars in the field if they didn't race the previous two WoO races? I don't see it.

they would start behind the guys that have raced the past 3 races hence lets say theres 14 outlaws this year lets say 10 outlaw regulars make the a main via the 3 heat races the best a guy who shows up once would be to start 11th, no worse then how most outsiders start now a days the odd time a 1 night guy starts in the top 10

lets say pittman schatz mcmahon saldana madsen sweet kinser kinser darrah swindell are the 10 outlaw regs made it through there heats

based on last 3 races money earned 

Row 1 Swindell K Kinser

Row 2 S Kinser Sweet

Row 3 Darah McMahon

Row 4 Madsen Saldana

Row 5 Schatz Pittman

then the next 8 spots for highest finishing outsiders in heat races

then the B Main top 6 Tag the end of the field 

Im sure there will be alot yay and nays lol

at least this way the Top earning cars are starting behond the 1st 3 rows every night

I think in 29 Races Schatz is the only driver to win starting outside the top 5 and he started 11th

I Know people will say the outsiders  wont come if the best they can start is 11th, but most of the outsiders would start worse then 10th  the way it is as it is now 

Then you dont need a dash a savings of 6+ laps on the racing surface

i know you'll say then the nights too short

but the most important part of the race we come to see is the feature, i gladly give up the dash race for a better race track come feature time for the drivers to pass on

if the cars are still equal after this then its the cars that need adjustments for better races for the lead

The shorter night doesn't bother me, but I think in places like California, Knoxville and central Pennsylvania, the locals might not like that system. Again, I don't look at starting spot. Watching a superior guy cut through the field and beat inferior people is not my idea of good...now, that doesn't happen with the outlaws. You can have a great race with a guy starting in the front row. 

It's pretty simple...

Any race the Outlaws win is a bad race.

Any race the Posse wins is a good race.

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

Multi car qualifying will.

.  

It's the same # of laps on the track whether it is multi-car or single car qualifying.  The main difference is Time.

Knoxville went to timing 3 cars at the same time last season.  They push off like they always did, take the green, then the white, then the checker and pull into the pits and hte next group pushes off.

Does it save 2/3 the time?  No, but it probably cuts it down by 1/3 which makes it worth it.  However, I don't think you could have more than 2 cars out there on a track less than 1/2 mile in length, so it won't work everywhere.

Agree, bad races are going to happen no matter what, however it seems that the WoO races have a good or great race only occassionally whereas they have rubber down racing 9 out of 10 events.  It's a track prep issue IMO (and the WoO try to dictate track prep at every track - they don't succeed everywhere though).

I no longer blame anything on Williams Grove Speedway.  I also no longer attend races at the same speedway.  I left that speedway far to many times saying I'm never going back, I'd be a fool to continue.  Thankfully I have other options.

I wise man once told me "some people make excuses while others make results".  When you continue to hear excuses from someone you know they are not attempting to make results.

Saturday's track was alot better than Friday's.  If the last half a feature is rubbering up and it becomes follow the leader around the bottom, I can understand where the too much racing on the track arguement comes into play.  At that point I understand its not of fault of the sanction body nor the track.

I also can understand the point of packing the track down and sealing it if bad weather is projected to give the tracka chance of racing.

What I don't understand is that in the instance of Friday night where the track was still sealed when warmups start, and the track knew and told everybody they were racing by around 1-2 PM that day. I action didn't start until 7-8 why they did not dig the track up and do their prep when they made the announcement.  If it delayed the start of events a little bit, would it have upset the fans, possibly, but at least it would have given the opportunity for a racier track for Friday night. 

One thing that I have noticed also is that the term "good race" is an opinion.  While somebody might say that the racing sucked because the winner came from the front row, the next person might say it was a good race because they seen 3rd-8th dicing it up for over half the race while somebody came from 12th to 4th.  Almost like the lap car argument on restarts.  Some people feel that lap cars should be there, others don't think it should be.  People also flip flop on that as well because it all depends on who it benefits at that time.

I disagree. I think multi-car TT's are FAR more interesting. You get to see who's gaining on who, plus it goes faster and it's more fair. Single car 2 lap TT's take forever and a day and are boring as hell. You should definitely be only timing against the cars in your heat to make it fair for everyone. When you have a car timing 45th on a track that's a second slower than when the 1st guy went out, how is that fair? 

A

Track prep is a lot like farming with the only difference being if you guess wrong on track prep people bitch about you on message boards and you can't collect crop insurance. 

Stan Meissner

in Dirt track Short track racing Time Trials has NEVER & NEVER will be a Fair way to TRULY Set the lineups for heat races

THE ONLY FAIR & SQUARE WAY to TRULY set the lineups is by pill drawing before the night starts 

the SMALL FUNDED TEAMS have just as much of an EQUAL CHANCE as a HIGH DOLLAR TEAM to start pole in there heat races 

this is Why this is how the heat races should truly be setup to determine the lineups for heat races

EQUAL CHANCE FOR EVERY RACE TEAM THIS WAY

I've always said time Trials ONLY BENEFIT THE HIGH DOLLAR TEAMS