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Topic: UMSS & JSTS Unable to Agree On Tire Rule For Series
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May 01, 2013 at
12:10:07 AM
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UMSS & JSTS Unable To Agree On Tire Rule, Nix MN Mafia Point Fund Series
By: Greg Parent, UMSS Media Director (4-30-13)
Unable to come to an agreement on the right rear tire rule for the planned Minnesota Mafia Point Fund series of races involving the Upper Midwest Sprintcar Series (UMSS) and the Jackson Speedway Touring Series (JSTS) cars, the proposed eleven race series had to be nixed. The Minnesota Mafia is working on putting together a series of races down in their part of the state while the UMSS is also working on a mini-series of races that are part of their current schedule for some added point fund money. Both groups will announce their revised plans in separate press releases.
The UMSS contract for their series is a three year deal from 2011-2013 calling for an SC25 Hoosier on the right rear. The JSTS has adopted the new Hoosier tire for 2013 which basically is a 16-medium or 18-hard. The UMSS received permission under their contract to allow either tire at the six UMSS races that were part of the original Minnesota Mafia Point Fund deal. The JSTS was unable to allow either tire at their events. "We tried to make it work, but we just could not come to an agreement on the tire rule for this series of races," stated UMSS President/CDO Ron Bernhagen. "We were flexible enough under our contract to try and make it work, but Jackson could not. I'm disappointed that the UMSS won't be able to participate in the Minnesota Mafia series of races, as the MN Mafia is comprised of a great group of sprint car fans who are working hard to help promote sprint car racing here in Minnesota," continued Bernhagen. Hopefully in the future, the groups can work together to come up with a more uniform set of rules especially involving tires.
The UMSS tire contract will be up after this season, so drivers and car owners will approve a new tire rule for 2014. "The current UMSS tire contract has worked very well for our drivers and for Hoosier Racing Tire. With one year left on our contract, I did not want to change it for 2013 unless I could obtain a better deal for our drivers," added Bernhagen. Since it's inception, one of the guiding principles for the UMSS has been to strive, wherever possible, to save the drivers money and also allow the drivers and car owners to have significant input in the rules process.
Fans will still see some great sprint car racing at UMSS events as well as at JSTS events in 2013. Several drivers should benefit with each group in earning some additional bonus money for the mini-series of races each group will have in place. The UMSS encourages all sprint car drivers to participate in as many races as possible with each group. Look for several more exciting announcements from the UMSS in separate press releases. Fans can follow the 2013 UMSS season on their website at www.umsprints.com or their Facebook page. We also need some cooperation from the weather in order to get the 2013 season underway!
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May 01, 2013 at
05:14:06 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: grp on May 01 2013 at 12:10:07 AM
UMSS & JSTS Unable To Agree On Tire Rule, Nix MN Mafia Point Fund Series
By: Greg Parent, UMSS Media Director (4-30-13)
Unable to come to an agreement on the right rear tire rule for the planned Minnesota Mafia Point Fund series of races involving the Upper Midwest Sprintcar Series (UMSS) and the Jackson Speedway Touring Series (JSTS) cars, the proposed eleven race series had to be nixed. The Minnesota Mafia is working on putting together a series of races down in their part of the state while the UMSS is also working on a mini-series of races that are part of their current schedule for some added point fund money. Both groups will announce their revised plans in separate press releases.
The UMSS contract for their series is a three year deal from 2011-2013 calling for an SC25 Hoosier on the right rear. The JSTS has adopted the new Hoosier tire for 2013 which basically is a 16-medium or 18-hard. The UMSS received permission under their contract to allow either tire at the six UMSS races that were part of the original Minnesota Mafia Point Fund deal. The JSTS was unable to allow either tire at their events. "We tried to make it work, but we just could not come to an agreement on the tire rule for this series of races," stated UMSS President/CDO Ron Bernhagen. "We were flexible enough under our contract to try and make it work, but Jackson could not. I'm disappointed that the UMSS won't be able to participate in the Minnesota Mafia series of races, as the MN Mafia is comprised of a great group of sprint car fans who are working hard to help promote sprint car racing here in Minnesota," continued Bernhagen. Hopefully in the future, the groups can work together to come up with a more uniform set of rules especially involving tires.
The UMSS tire contract will be up after this season, so drivers and car owners will approve a new tire rule for 2014. "The current UMSS tire contract has worked very well for our drivers and for Hoosier Racing Tire. With one year left on our contract, I did not want to change it for 2013 unless I could obtain a better deal for our drivers," added Bernhagen. Since it's inception, one of the guiding principles for the UMSS has been to strive, wherever possible, to save the drivers money and also allow the drivers and car owners to have significant input in the rules process.
Fans will still see some great sprint car racing at UMSS events as well as at JSTS events in 2013. Several drivers should benefit with each group in earning some additional bonus money for the mini-series of races each group will have in place. The UMSS encourages all sprint car drivers to participate in as many races as possible with each group. Look for several more exciting announcements from the UMSS in separate press releases. Fans can follow the 2013 UMSS season on their website at www.umsprints.com or their Facebook page. We also need some cooperation from the weather in order to get the 2013 season underway!
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Plain and simple open it up to run witch ever one you want. If you think one or the other is an advantage buy that one and run it. Everyone has to buy tires anyway sooner or later.
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May 01, 2013 at
05:45:21 PM
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Sounds like UMSS and JSTS are doing their best impersonation of Congress. 
Stan Meissner
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May 01, 2013 at
06:37:15 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: StanM on May 01 2013 at 05:45:21 PM
Sounds like UMSS and JSTS are doing their best impersonation of Congress.
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I think it was a big mistake on both sides part. If the umss or jsts goes away there will no longer be 360 sprints in Mn or at least within 4 hours of the twin cities. They really need to make it work for the future of the sport in the upper Midwest.
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May 01, 2013 at
08:54:28 PM
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They had 10 race nights on the schedule. Most of the guys would need at least 3 right rears for that many nights. It's not like it's a one night show. Maybe the MN Mafia should set the tire rule for the series since they are the ones putting up the money for points fund. It's too bad that two people that have done so much for sprint car racing will let tires dictate the future.
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May 01, 2013 at
10:27:46 PM
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It was my understanding that at one point this was all set, what changed? When it started it was supposed to be UMSS rules at their races and JSTS rules at their races what could be simpler? I don't think the UMSS changed anything, and when I checked they said the JSTS could run their tire so again what changed? One of the above posters said you would have to buy 3 or 4 tires to run with the JSTS rules I think you would have to buy a wheel for that 16 inch tire too. Plus if they enforced all their rules the UMSS guys would have to buy stacks that makes it 1500 to 2000 bucks for those races.
I do agree the Minnesota Maifa
is the best thing to come along for 360 racing around here lately.
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May 03, 2013 at
05:50:28 AM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Fast20mn on May 01 2013 at 06:37:15 PM
I think it was a big mistake on both sides part. If the umss or jsts goes away there will no longer be 360 sprints in Mn or at least within 4 hours of the twin cities. They really need to make it work for the future of the sport in the upper Midwest.
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My gas and hot dog reserves are at an all time low so I don't have a dog in this dispute. Jackson and South Dakota are off the map and all of my racing will be at two tracks 32 miles from home. Makes me long for the good ol' days when gas was cheap enough that CLS would cancel and I'd have enough loose change in my pocket to make a run to Jax. Those were good times for me because the first racing I watched as a kid was on the big half miles. I always enjoyed racing down in that area. Hope they can work something out for the future and maybe I'll get back down there someday.
Stan Meissner
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May 03, 2013 at
06:33:26 AM
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I can't believe the rules weren't determined before any announcments. As a fan, upset with both organizations.
Now the MN Mafia has turned into the MIS Mafia (MN, IA, SD)
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May 03, 2013 at
08:08:42 AM
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As you all know this seems to have hurt the state of sprint car racing in Minnesota. To set the record straight the UMSS agreed with the JSTS and the MN Mafia to this PROPOSED joining only if the few rule differences could be over come. 1. Restrictors: JSTS cars running the UMSS sanctioned races had to run our 1 7/8" restrictors. UMSS cars running JSTS sanction races would follow JSTS engine rules. 2. Weight Rule. Each sanctioning bodies rule would apply at their sanctioned track. Same as the engine rule. 3. Tires. The JSTS and UMSS run the same tires ( OR DID) when this was agreed upon there was no ISUSES 4. All was agreed on However JSTS choose to vacate the last year of there tire contract with Hoosier that allowed them to receive free tires and money . 250.00 per nite plus 1 free right rear for 10 cars per and an additional free left rear tire 15 and over. The UMSS stayed with it because we felt the benefit was greater to or owners. JSTS choose to go to the current ASCS Med 16" right rear., same compound and side wall as the SC 25 but of course 2" narrower and the JSTS would receive a "per car" money supplement. In lies the problem. You can't, with any success, run a 16" tire and an 18" wheel. It is a proven fact there is a difference. The sidewall will become stiffer on the narrow tire- wider wheel scenario loosing a fair amount of side bite.. The JSTS and a few of there supporters argued that the UMSS would have an advantage over them on the SC 25 and therefore refused to let the UMSS run it. This would force the UMSS cars to not only buy their tire, which violate our contract with Hoosier, but forces the UMSS cars to buy wheels not budgeted for. Given that fact plus travel cost, motel rooms, etc. We had no choice but to withdraw, The reward for the UMSS was far less then the cost. The UMSS understands why The MN Mafia choose to support the races of the JSTS. All of the money raised was from that area. Ron and I sent a last proposal to let the shows run " Either OR". Ron's exact words to Shane Phillips were" Lets allow both so the teams that can afford it will buy it and the ones that can't can run what they have", Hoping to hold it together but it was rejected by the JSTS. In the experience of Hoosier there is not much of and advantage. The SC 25 would help a little on a super slick track, The Med. would help a little on a more tacky track. Again this all depends on "WHO" is driving and setting up the car. All the finger pointing in the world will not fix this sprint car racing. The only thing that would is a national 360 tire rule mandating all 360 sprint cars run the same tires. In a democracy how would this law be passed or enforced........ We need sound people making sound decisions for the BETTERMENT of Sprint Car Racing. We all thought this would work..... The JSTS did what they thought was best for them. The Mafia did what they thought was best for Sprint car racing it that area. We of the UMSS will continue to do what we think is best for our Car owner, drivers, promoters, and our loyal fans. Enjoy our " 6 Pack series." 2013 will entertain you. Joe Kouba UMSS Technical Director
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May 03, 2013 at
05:37:23 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: JRKracer on May 03 2013 at 08:08:42 AM
As you all know this seems to have hurt the state of sprint car racing in Minnesota. To set the record straight the UMSS agreed with the JSTS and the MN Mafia to this PROPOSED joining only if the few rule differences could be over come. 1. Restrictors: JSTS cars running the UMSS sanctioned races had to run our 1 7/8" restrictors. UMSS cars running JSTS sanction races would follow JSTS engine rules. 2. Weight Rule. Each sanctioning bodies rule would apply at their sanctioned track. Same as the engine rule. 3. Tires. The JSTS and UMSS run the same tires ( OR DID) when this was agreed upon there was no ISUSES 4. All was agreed on However JSTS choose to vacate the last year of there tire contract with Hoosier that allowed them to receive free tires and money . 250.00 per nite plus 1 free right rear for 10 cars per and an additional free left rear tire 15 and over. The UMSS stayed with it because we felt the benefit was greater to or owners. JSTS choose to go to the current ASCS Med 16" right rear., same compound and side wall as the SC 25 but of course 2" narrower and the JSTS would receive a "per car" money supplement. In lies the problem. You can't, with any success, run a 16" tire and an 18" wheel. It is a proven fact there is a difference. The sidewall will become stiffer on the narrow tire- wider wheel scenario loosing a fair amount of side bite.. The JSTS and a few of there supporters argued that the UMSS would have an advantage over them on the SC 25 and therefore refused to let the UMSS run it. This would force the UMSS cars to not only buy their tire, which violate our contract with Hoosier, but forces the UMSS cars to buy wheels not budgeted for. Given that fact plus travel cost, motel rooms, etc. We had no choice but to withdraw, The reward for the UMSS was far less then the cost. The UMSS understands why The MN Mafia choose to support the races of the JSTS. All of the money raised was from that area. Ron and I sent a last proposal to let the shows run " Either OR". Ron's exact words to Shane Phillips were" Lets allow both so the teams that can afford it will buy it and the ones that can't can run what they have", Hoping to hold it together but it was rejected by the JSTS. In the experience of Hoosier there is not much of and advantage. The SC 25 would help a little on a super slick track, The Med. would help a little on a more tacky track. Again this all depends on "WHO" is driving and setting up the car. All the finger pointing in the world will not fix this sprint car racing. The only thing that would is a national 360 tire rule mandating all 360 sprint cars run the same tires. In a democracy how would this law be passed or enforced........ We need sound people making sound decisions for the BETTERMENT of Sprint Car Racing. We all thought this would work..... The JSTS did what they thought was best for them. The Mafia did what they thought was best for Sprint car racing it that area. We of the UMSS will continue to do what we think is best for our Car owner, drivers, promoters, and our loyal fans. Enjoy our " 6 Pack series." 2013 will entertain you. Joe Kouba UMSS Technical Director |
Thanks for the detailed explanation Joe. Everybody involved in this deal are good people that love Sprint Car racing so it's just one of those unfortunate circumstances that it couldn't work out. The ground work has been set for the coming years so maybe things can be ironed out in the future.
Stan Meissner
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May 03, 2013 at
05:38:15 PM
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There shouldn't be any finger pointing going on in this situation. These are the points that we think matter:
1. To the credit of everyone involved, all parties came to the table last fall looking to do something that would benefit the TEAMS and DRIVERS that make message boards like this exist.
2. Both the UMSS and JSTS made concessions regarding scheduling conflicts so participation would be as easy as possible for the TEAMS and DRIVERS. As well as fill in the gaps in the regional schedule so fans would have a bunch of quality shows to attend through out the summer.
3. Everyone agreed that the sanctioning body holding the race would dictate the motor rules. Tires weren't an issue as both series had similar tire contracts, etc. when we originally agreed to the framework of this "series".
4. The JSTS did what it thought was in the best interest of their DRIVERS and TEAMS in then switching to the 16" tire. They did so after considering input from their teams. The UMSS kept their tire for the same reasons.
5. This brought up a situation that required both parties to find a workable solution that was in the best interest of the DRIVERS and TEAMS they were representing. The Mafia tried to facilitate a compromise.
6. Because of differing opinions on cost of participation(new rim or not, the Mafia raised a considerable amount of bonus money to defray actual cost of tires for UMSS cars at Speedweeks to the point we didn't think it was an issue) and performance of the tire a resolution couldn't be reached. Hoosier was on board with whatever compromise was reached, they saw the benefit in what the "series" was meant to be. The UMSS decided it was in the best interest of the TEAMS and DRIVERS it represents to withdraw their support.
7. This forced us to reschedule the UMSS portion of our schedule. We put together a new schedule with the enthusiastic support of Husets Speedway and Rapid Speedway to go along with the already scheduled JSTS shows. We think the tire rules at the participating tracks allows the greatest number of DRIVERS and TEAMS to participate give our geography and the commonality of the rules.
8. We scheduled races as to not directly conflict with any scheduled UMSS races. We want to give DRIVERS and TEAMS the best opportunity to compete if they so choose. We also respect the UMSS and what it has done for racing since it's inception and won't, to the best of our ability, do anything to step on their toes. We appreciate the DRIVERS and TEAMS who race with them. They are a fun group and true racers and we hope to put some extra money in their pockets this year regardless of the present circumstance.
9. We came to Ron Bernhagen and Jon McCorkell this fall with an idea we thought could really benefit the DRIVERS and TEAMS we love to watch as well as other fans like us. We're extremely disappointed in all parties involved, ourselves included, that we let circumstances prevent us from "seeing the forest from the trees", so they say. There was a solution to be found but not the willingness to get it done. That being said, we move on.
10. Don't point fingers. All parties went down this road with good intentions. As disappointing as this is, we are moving in the right direction. With a common tire rule going forward we have laid the framework for cooperation in the future. We all want the same thing...for our sport to flourish. The Minnesota Mafia will continue to encourage and try to facilitate that happening.
11. We capitalized DRIVERS and TEAMS throughout this message to emphasize why all of us are reading this and why the Mafia was formed, to support the people who make our sport what it is....THE RACERS!
12. Go to UMSS races. Go to JSTS races. Go to Mafia races. Go to your local track(if they have sprints). SUPPORT SPRINT CAR RACING! We're sorry for being long winded. We hope this clarified things. We're open to answering any questions. Thanks for taking the time to read this whole boring rant. See ya at the races!
Shane Phillips
"Race Fans Helping Racers"
theminnesotamafia.com
facebook.com/theminnesotamafia
@MinnesotaMafia on Twitter
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May 03, 2013 at
05:45:00 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Wingman on May 03 2013 at 06:33:26 AM
I can't believe the rules weren't determined before any announcments. As a fan, upset with both organizations.
Now the MN Mafia has turned into the MIS Mafia (MN, IA, SD)
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Things change in racing on fast and often continuous basis. Everyone put forth effort in coming to a resolution. We wish it would have not taken this path. That being said we're really excited about our new schedule and the guys we can help out. As far as your MIS Mafia comment it's bordering on clever. Sounds better than WIM Mafia I guess.  Don't care what you call us as long as you keep supporting sprint car racing!
"Race Fans Helping Racers"
theminnesotamafia.com
facebook.com/theminnesotamafia
@MinnesotaMafia on Twitter
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May 04, 2013 at
12:20:50 AM
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This message was edited on
May 04, 2013 at
12:23:45 AM by kpwinters
Im just curious, what would of been the problem with allowing any of the 3 HOOSIER RR tires run at all the Mafia series races??
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May 04, 2013 at
08:27:06 AM
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This message was edited on
May 04, 2013 at
08:43:54 AM by Jon McCorkell
Kent - One tire is wider, and that is the one most teams would feel they need to run. And that is the tire we are no longer on.
Our drivers voted to go with the Hoisser Medium (ASCS Tire) tire.
There were a bunch of factors that went in to this, it is quite a bit cheaper for the racers to buy, the sc-25 has been discontinued, etc.
But I think the biggest thing that our drivers wanted to do was to get their set-ups dialed in to the 16", so when all 3 of the big series come to Jackson they at least have been on that tire. Or when they go to Knoxville, or an ASCS race.
But all that does not matter in regards to this topic.
It comes down to the groups ended up on a different RR tire.
There are other differences in rules as well, like stacks and weight.
We told our drivers the UMSS has some different rules, and if you want to go up there and run you have to abide by there rules. Although not perfect, We felt the series was still well worth it, and were looking forward to it.
Joe sums up their position really well. The UMSS did not feel it was in their best interest for their guys to have to run the Hoisser Medium, so they withdrew for the Mafia Series.
We respect their decision and wish them well.
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