Always good to see a knowledgable fan posting accurate numbers. LOL The post right above yours mentioned there were 14 different winners at the Grove last not counting the Outlaw races and then you wonder if there are even seven guys in PA capable of winning a race. People are supposed to take you seriously when you don't know what you are talking about?

The last time Lance went to Attica for the Brad Doty a few years back during a year he won about everything in PA he was lapped traffic and the guy that won the race was named Alvin Roepke who is as obscure a racer as you'll find, even in Ohio. Nice guy, nice car owner and Mountain Dew on the Wing, what a night that was. The G-Man was a RACER and well on his way to some fame and smart enough to leave the porch, I miss him to this day. Take It Easy....

PS Wasn't Wagner a full-time All-Star racer that year?

Mike, your are correct with your information. Wagner was following the All-Star tour that year, but that doesn't change the fact that he is still a guy that has been a regular in central Pennsylvania for nearly 20 years. He is a solid local driver, but has less than a dozen wins in his career in PA. If the original poster is going to make such a blanket statement, then it should be noted a mid-range PA team won at Fremont.

I don' think Saldana's been sandbagging during time-trials, and he just won the a-main after being 1st in time trials. Hmmm, 4th to 2nd in heat, 1st in dash, 1st in a-main, not easy.

I remember Mike winning a B-main at Fremont not an A main.

All Star Sprint Results -- Fremont Speedway -- Fri. September 6, 2002

Time Trials: 1. Paul McMahan, Johnson U2, 12.295; 2. Chad Kemenah, Harble 15k, 12.344; 3. Jeff Shepard, Ashworth 92, 12.380; 4. Byron Reed, B&S 5, 12.408; 5. Jason Johnson, Harrison 22, 12.408; 6. Shane Stewart, Holbrook 8h, 12.410; 7. Danny Smith, Webb 51, 12.439; 8. Kenny Jacobs, Jacobs 6, 12.440; 9. Mike Wagner, Wagner 55, 12.467; 10. Kyle Sauder, Pullins 29, 12.505; 11. John Ivy, Carousel 20, 12.506; 12. Brian Smith, Burmeister 16, 12.513; 13. Greg Wilson, Hampshire 63, 12.529; 14. Dale Blaney, Andrews 72b, 12.540; 15. Phil Gressman, Miller 2, 12.541; 16. Kelly Kinser, Kinser 4k, 12.565; 17. Mark Keegan, Steinbrick 92, 12.582; 18. Butch Schroeder, Steinbrick 92x, 12.712; 19. Mike Linder, James 3, 12.771; 20. Bill Rose, Rose 6B, 12.780; 21. Bobby Clark, Clark 8, 12.781; 22. Dustin Daggett, Daggett 85, 12.847; 23. Barry Ruble, Ruble 63r, 12.848; 24. Dean Jacobs, Baker 34, 12.849; 25. Rob Chaney, Courtad 9x, 12.884; 26. Troy Vacarro, Vacarro 7T, 12.905; 27. Lee Jacobs, Jacobs 2, 12.925; 28. Todd Kane, Kane 78, 12.927; 29. Andrew Palker, Palker 57x, 12.958; 30. David Harrison, Harrison 44, 12.998; 31. Jeremy Campbell, Campbell 10c, 13.013; 32. John Wisbon, Riehl 55, 13.030; 33. Bruce Robenalt, Robenalt 98, 13.032; 34. Andy James, James 72, 13.032; 35. Shawn Chaney, Chaney 27c, 13.042; 36. Chad Blonde, Blonde 5, 13.060; 37. Todd Heller, Heller 14h, 13.130; 38. Doug Berryman, Berryman 1, 13.228; 39. Jim Dayton, Dayton 2x, 13.253; 40. Alvin Roepke, Roepke/Ford 99, 13.298; 41. Jason Courtney, Courtney 9c, 13.485; 42. Chuck Waddell, Waddell 22, 13.503; 43. Mark Imler, Imler 40, 13.538; 44. Duffy Smith, Mulheim 38k, 13.807; 45. Jeff Hardwick, Hardwick 14, 14.044; 46. Bill Shaw, Shaw 48, 14.300; 47. Jeremiah Keegan, Keegan Y, 14.630; 48. Joe Laugherty, Laugherty 21J, 14.768; 49. Chuck Wilson, Wilson 31, NT.

Crown Battery Heat (10 laps): 1. Clark 2. M. Keegan 3. G. Wilson 4. McMahan 5. Johnson 6. Wagner 7. Palker 8. R. Chaney 9. Robenalt 10. C. Wilson 11. Courtney 12. Hardwick 13. Heller.

B&B Products Heat (10 laps): 1. Kemenah 2. Blaney 3. Stewart 4. Schroeder 5. Daggett 6. Sauder 7. Vacarro 8. Harrison 9. James 10. Waddell 11. Berryman 12. Shaw.

Engler Machine & Tool Heat (10 laps): 1. Shepard 2. Ivy 3. Linder 4. Gressman 5. Danny Smith 6. L. Jacobs 7. Campbell 8. S. Chaney 9. Imler 10. Dayton 11. J. Keegan 12. Ruble.

TP Wings Heat (10 laps): 1. Rose 2. D. Jacobs 3. Kinser 4. Reed 5. K. Jacobs 6. Kane 7. Roepke 8. Wisbon 9. Blonde 10. Duffy Smith 11. Laugherty 12. B. Smith.

Georgia Marketing & Promotions C Main (10 laps): 1. Heller 2. Berryman 3. Roepke 4. Dayton 5. Courtney 6. Waddell 7. Imler 8. Shaw 9. Hardwick 10. Laugherty 11. C. Wilson 12. Duffy Smith.

United Aluminum Window Sales & Consulting B Main (12 laps): 1. Wagner 2. Sauder 3. B. Smith 4. R. Chaney 5. Vacarro 6. Harrison 7. Kane 8. Campbell 9. Palker 10. James 11. Roepke 12. Robenalt 13. Berryman 14. S. Chaney 15. Dayton 16. Wisbon 17. Heller 18. Ruble 19. Blonde 20. L. Jacobs.

A Main (30 laps): 1. Shane Stewart 2. Kenny Jacobs 3. Jeff Shepard 4. Paul McMahan 5. Chad Kemenah 6. Danny Smith 7. Greg Wilson 8. Kelly Kinser 9. Rob Chaney 10. Phil Gressman 11. Mark Keegan 12. Byron Reed 13. John Ivy 14. Dean Jacobs 15. Bill Rose 16. Brian Smith 17. Butch Schroeder 18. Mike Linder 19. Kyle Sauder 20. Dustin Daggett 21. Bob Clark 22. Jason Johnson 23. Mike Wagner 24. Dale Blaney.

Lap Leaders: Shane Stewart 1-30

If it was a different night I apologize. This is all I found after skimming through the allstar archives.

...

Seven of the top 8 finishers that night have all WON W of O shows, that's kinda impressive, right? Ten All-Stars in the A-Main on this night have won W of O shows in their careers, not too shabby, right? Take It Easy....

MSPN, I wasn't trying to prove anything by posting those results. Just trying to clear up the statement about Mike Wagner. That doesn't mean that I have anything against Mike either. I remember seeing him run several times that year with the allstars and the impression that I got was that he was bustin ass and doing the best he could. That's all that matters to me and probably most fans.

...

In 2007 Willaims Grove will have 8 - 10 drivers in the field EVERY Friday night that have won WoO features. Pretty impressive isn't it MSPN ?

Dewease

Rahmer

Esh

Shaffer

Hodnett

Keel

Kauffman

Krietz

Shepard

M. Smith

37 total A-Main wins and no record of how many prelims on top of that number.

327 WoO full A-Main wins have been won by drivers that have been regulars at Williams Grove . I could nit pick and get a few more , but I only counted drivers that ran AT LEAST three full seasons at the Grove .

since when is anyone going to take anything in this thread serious? the post above mine said there were 14 winners LAST year. i am talking about THIS year. lol

Yeah, they can run the Grove but most of those guys aren't even competitive anywhere with the Outlaws at any other track. Some of them aren't competitive there anymore either, sheesh. Out of curiousity, I liked him when he ran the tour as well but where did Craig Keel beat the Outlaws? Him and his Dad worked harder than most the years I saw them on the road. Once again, it's the Grove factor making the Posse look good, remember where you heard about it first, lol. Take It Easy....

So there are only going to be seven different winners at the Grove this not counting the Outlaw shows? Wow, I will take any action you are willing to provide on that statement. And just think, the first three shows of the season have already been cancelled.

Guess you don't know much about the history of racing in central Pennsyvlvania, huh? Even in years of one driver dominating the wins at Williams Grove, there are always 12-13 different winners of the weekly shows.

I will give you eight drivers right now that will win at the Grove this season: Rahmer, Dewease, Hodnett, Shepard, Esh, Shaffer, Wolfe and Montieth.

Wrong. The information is easily available online by visiting Fremont's website and looking at the race by race All-Star winners at the track.. The date was September 7, 2001,

Anyway, there is no way MSPN would acknowledge that Wagner A-main win if it didn't happen. LOL.

I actually have to agree with Mike about Craig Keel. He never beat the Outlaws. I remember the first year I went to the Knoxville Nationals (1992), Keel was leading his preliminary night feature and would have started about fifth or sixth Saturday night if he had won his prelim night, but he blew up leading. Instead, it ended up being another 500-point prelim night for Steve Kinser.

Didn't Keel win a WoO prelim (they should count as feature wins) in '91 out west??

Jim Fisher

www.fscpictorial.com

.

I remember seeing Craig changing motors by a closed down garage somewhere between Knoxville and Des Moines that year, he's another very good shoe who could have done much more with some good equipment and help back in the day.  Take It Easy....

Yup, you are correct. I was looking in the wrong year of the archives. No idea why I don't remember that night. There is no doubt that I was there.

Fremont race results 2001-09-07

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I'll have to check into it , but I'm 99% sure Keel won a preliminary race when he drove the red Challenger #8 . If not , then I'll subtract him from that statement and and say there will be 7 - 9 former WoO winners every week at the Grove . Where else does that happen ? Probably not evne a regular WoO race . j/k LOL.

But way to nit pick there MSPN , you're still an asshole.

Maybe Keel does have a prelim win, but I was pretty sure he didn't have a regular WoO win. I know Kevin Eckert has written several times in the past that Keel always mentions to him that he beat out Bob McCreadie for rookie of the year with the Northeast DIRT Modified group in 1981.

Yeah, but Barefoot Bob's a legend. Ever heard of Donnie Wetmore? My dad was on his pit crew. He's still the all-time winningest driver at Fulton Speedway.

Rogue, I grew up as a dirt Modified fan and traveled all over New York following the DIRT series. Sure, I am familiar with Donnie Wetmore. I remember him back in the days of the Harry Murphy No. M1 all the way up through the Nice 'N Easy No. 73D years. I remember when Donnie used to have his race shop right across from the Port 40 motel in Weedsport, just down from Weedsport Speedway (Cayuga County).

The first year I went to the Vic 200 (1987), Wetmore gave Billy Pauch all he could handle for the win.