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Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
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Topic: why fast time sucks [especially at knoxville] Email this topic to a friend | Subscribe to this TopicReport this Topic to Moderator
Page 1 of 1   of  17 replies
joemad
May 25, 2009 at 07:19:54 AM
Joined: 08/07/2008
Posts: 16
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sprintcar racin' the only sport in the world where top qualifier gets put in the penalty box! at knoxville you get to start 3rd row in your heat and maybe 6th row in the 20 lap feature which unless there is a couple of yellows and maybe a red your'e hurtin to make the trophy stand......now i know somebody has to put on show for the fans but it should be the guys who screwed up in qualifying, not the fast timers. invert 4 and run a 25 lap feature.




Speedbump
May 25, 2009 at 09:57:19 AM
Joined: 11/30/2004
Posts: 1460
Reply

I think the winner needs to prove he can race against other cars, not turn a fast lap all by himself.

better yet, ditch time trials altogether and put on a better show for the fans.



butchknouse37
May 26, 2009 at 06:50:21 AM
Joined: 03/11/2005
Posts: 520
Reply
Reply to:
Posted By: joemad on May 25 2009 at 07:19:54 AM

sprintcar racin' the only sport in the world where top qualifier gets put in the penalty box! at knoxville you get to start 3rd row in your heat and maybe 6th row in the 20 lap feature which unless there is a couple of yellows and maybe a red your'e hurtin to make the trophy stand......now i know somebody has to put on show for the fans but it should be the guys who screwed up in qualifying, not the fast timers. invert 4 and run a 25 lap feature.



How about Pennsylvania style, where the high point average car starts 12th? People have somehow managed to wins dozens of features under that system.




spot1
May 26, 2009 at 07:15:42 AM
Joined: 12/14/2004
Posts: 622
Reply

Imagine that.........you actually have to pass if you want to win.......wtf are they thinking? You actually have to race.........

 



Lanman
May 26, 2009 at 08:46:11 AM
Joined: 11/30/2004
Posts: 205
Reply
Reply to:
Posted By: butchknouse37 on May 26 2009 at 06:50:21 AM

How about Pennsylvania style, where the high point average car starts 12th? People have somehow managed to wins dozens of features under that system.



You need to update your facts Mr. Knouse. They no longer do the 12 invert in PA, at least at the grove, as the drivers and car-owners griped that all the cars were to equal anymore and that it was too hard to win from 12th. Im sure BRR or Cubic will be along to confirm this for me in a little bit.



pittmanfan
MyWebsite
May 26, 2009 at 09:20:44 AM
Joined: 05/19/2006
Posts: 290
Reply

Yes, some drivers did gripe about PA handicapping, but they did not change anything. High points drivers still start mid pack IF they are fortunate enough to drive from the back of the heat race and into an invert position.


...


dsc1600
May 26, 2009 at 10:00:44 AM
Joined: 05/31/2007
Posts: 3990
Reply

And how many times has that system brought a winner from 12th in the last 3 or 4 years at the Grove? It just doesn't happen very much anymore.



Lumpy Rutherford
MyWebsite
May 26, 2009 at 10:22:15 AM
Joined: 03/29/2008
Posts: 214
Reply

.... so there's a large variety of different drivers taking the wins instead of the same guy winning every night, as a fan why is this a bad thing?



backstretchofficial42
May 26, 2009 at 10:52:40 AM
Joined: 11/24/2007
Posts: 30
Reply

At Knoxville they invert the heat races by 6 and than the fast qualifier draws a pill of 4,6,8,10,12 so than that is the invert for the 360 A and also 410 A so what are u gonna say now it screws the 360's too

 




mbmotorspt
May 26, 2009 at 11:37:43 AM
Joined: 12/09/2004
Posts: 339
Reply

Yeah. Nothing like starting 12th in a 15 lap race!


Rome wasn't built in a day......but they sure didn't
waste any time burning it down!

singlefile
May 26, 2009 at 11:58:26 AM
Joined: 04/24/2005
Posts: 1307
Reply
This message was edited on May 26, 2009 at 12:32:27 PM by singlefile
Reply to:
Posted By: Lanman on May 26 2009 at 08:46:11 AM

You need to update your facts Mr. Knouse. They no longer do the 12 invert in PA, at least at the grove, as the drivers and car-owners griped that all the cars were to equal anymore and that it was too hard to win from 12th. Im sure BRR or Cubic will be along to confirm this for me in a little bit.



You are mistaken. The invert is still 12 for regular shows in central PA. There has been some b*tching the last couple years about guys working the handicapping system, but there have not been any changes put in place.



Oppermanfan
May 26, 2009 at 01:00:21 PM
Joined: 08/06/2008
Posts: 439
Reply

I have been attending Knoxville for years and can't find anybody that can explain the 360's scoring and point system to me. Does anybody know? The people that do know didn't want anything to do with wasting their time to explain it to me.




johnny5
May 26, 2009 at 01:27:34 PM
Joined: 05/26/2009
Posts: 38
Reply
Reply to:
Posted By: Oppermanfan on May 26 2009 at 01:00:21 PM

I have been attending Knoxville for years and can't find anybody that can explain the 360's scoring and point system to me. Does anybody know? The people that do know didn't want anything to do with wasting their time to explain it to me.



the 360's are scored like this for lineup purposes for the night,just like the old ASCS system. 55 points given for a heat win and each position decreases by 3 points with a bonus of 1.5 for every position that is improved(passing points). then they invert either a 6,8,10,or 12.

now for the point system- heat race points are 20 for a win and decreasing by 2 per position and then again getting 1.5 points for every pass. B-main points are awarded to the top 4(20,15,10,and 5). Feature points are like this 100 for first decreasing by 10 for the first 6 positions and then by 5 points back to 13th. spots 14 to 16 are all awarded 10 points and 17 on back all receive 5 points. all cars receive 15 show up points but these are not awarded to cars that earn more than 15 points.



paydirt28
May 26, 2009 at 01:31:50 PM
Joined: 01/26/2009
Posts: 795
Reply
This message was edited on May 26, 2009 at 01:35:47 PM by paydirt28
Reply to:
Posted By: Oppermanfan on May 26 2009 at 01:00:21 PM

I have been attending Knoxville for years and can't find anybody that can explain the 360's scoring and point system to me. Does anybody know? The people that do know didn't want anything to do with wasting their time to explain it to me.



Everybody draws a pill at the gate to determine heat race line-up. They award 1.5 points for each position gained in the heat race in addition to the finishing points. 20 points for first, 18, 16... What I don't know is if they draw for the invert each night or if it's always a ten car invert. But that's how they line them up for the feature. 100 points to the winner of the feature and they decrease by ten points per position down to 6th and then it goes down by five points per position.



paydirt28
May 26, 2009 at 01:35:03 PM
Joined: 01/26/2009
Posts: 795
Reply

Johnny5 beat me to it. Looks like he gave a better explanation of it anyway.




Bill W
MyWebsite
May 26, 2009 at 10:20:20 PM
Joined: 11/23/2004
Posts: 5047
Reply

In talking to Bruce Ellis in PA, Williams Grove has only had one handicapping show all year. I asked a driver, and he thought there may have been 2...

Knoxville does not have an option of a 4 invert. The pills are 6, 8, 10 or 12...


If this post isn't results, stories or something c
constructive, it isn't me! 
@BillWMedia
www.OpenWheel101.com

slideguy
May 27, 2009 at 06:52:02 AM
Joined: 12/03/2004
Posts: 407
Reply

The Pennsylvania system is absolutely awesome. While it makes perfect sense why the drivers do not enjoy it, the racing is really top notch. I doubt they could get to point handicapping at Knoxville. It would really impact the "drop ins" that usually contribute 3-5 cars every week to the field.



pittmanfan
MyWebsite
May 27, 2009 at 08:06:29 AM
Joined: 05/19/2006
Posts: 290
Reply
Reply to:
Posted By: Bill W on May 26 2009 at 10:20:20 PM

In talking to Bruce Ellis in PA, Williams Grove has only had one handicapping show all year. I asked a driver, and he thought there may have been 2...

Knoxville does not have an option of a 4 invert. The pills are 6, 8, 10 or 12...



Bruce is correct. Due to the later start of the season, both races in March were draw shows, then they ran a handicapping show that Dewease won from 7th. Since then, there have been 4 time trial shows.

3 handicapping shows were lost due to rain and 4 of the next 5 are handicapping shows.


...



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