Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Could someone explain this better than Flo did in their news website? The math seems wrong time from their report.

They say Sweet will get his average position points while sitting out, plus 5 points for a total of 51 points 

What the heck, medical provisionals? That's the dumbest thing I have heard, even worse than the normal provisionals. Show up and race your way in is how it should be. You miss the cut tough crap.

According to HL rules, it's average finish + 5 positions.  I haven't read the release, but 51 points is equal to 11th place.  According to Sprint Car Ratings (thanks, BillV99!) Brad Sweet's average HL finish in 2025 is 6.8.  So the series must round down on your average, then add 5 positions...hence 11th place points for Sweet.

The idea of hardship points isn't new.  The WoO have had them for a long time.  I recall Danny Lasoski getting them while driving for TSR as the first time I'd heard of it.  A "medical provisional" and the math to get there are new to me, though.  IMO they should give it a different name, and they're giving out too many points for not being able to compete.  Unless I'm misunderstanding the process, if Rico finishes worse than 11th Sweet will actually EXTEND his points lead without even competing.  That doesn't seem right.

Signature here.

Here you go. Fairly simple explanation.  

Medical Provisionals Explained �

High Limit Racing allows medical provisionals for drivers sidelined due to injury. If a driver is injured and needs recovery time, they may be granted a 10-day medical provisional. During this time, the driver and/or car will be awarded points equal to their average finish plus five positions — but only if the driver is evaluated by a reputable doctor approved by High Limit officials.

Teams may substitute drivers during this period, but will only receive points based on their on-track result — not the guaranteed provisional points.

After 10 days, one extension may be granted with approval. Medical provisionals are not available during the first two weekends of the season. Returning teams will use the previous season’s average finish if needed; new teams can establish their average after the opening two weekends.

By rule:

 • Kasey Kahne Racing #49 will receive 51 points (6.3 average finish + 5).

 • Ridge & Sons Racing #87 will receive 49 points (6.8 average finish + 5).

Follow up...

After perusing the press release, HL stated that Sweet has a 6.3 average finish and Reutzel has a 6.8 average finish.  Reutzel will receive 49 points for his medical provisional, which would be 12th place.  Don't know how their average is 0.5 places better than BillV99's?

I posted a question to the series on X/Twitter about the possibility of Sweet extending his point lead without competing.  We'll see what they say.

And for the record, I'm not against the idea of hardship points.  It's another perk of series membership.  Overall I'd probably be in favor of hardship points and provisionals going away.  But I get the idea of why both exist and I'm not going to go nuts over it.

Signature here.

If that is the case why not give Arron medical points for the Las Vegas race when he was medically unable to run the A-main ?

Rules drivers agree on before they sign their contracts does not concern me at all.  Once again, I'll stick to my original prediction that the only way the High Limit will survive, is to become the WoO.  They are doing great at pissing people off because of their loyalty to their contracted drivers, so another notch in the belt for the HL in achieving this!  Just a few more steps and they'll be there.................Already had "scale-gate!",  "over-looking illegal parts gate" and "wing-gate."  They are right on pace to have the other 1/2 of the sprint car world pissed off!!!   

In all seriousness, you have to take care of those that take care of you.  Much like the WoO has been doing for years with their platinum drivers, the HL is going to have to take steps to protect the guys on their poster.  They've done that, and kudos.  Looking more and more like that dreaded, three-headed monster the WoO every day!   Only one thing left for the HL to do................get their drivers away from these crown jewel events that have the WoO stamp on them---either by scheduling against them, or prying them away from the Outlaws and making them HL shows with the financial backing of Flo................coming soon!  Stay tuned!   Then, all of you Outlaw haters will have exactly what you wanted!  A series that overtakes the WoO, yet acts exactly like the WoO.  Both series are doing exactly what they need to do in this business, so unsure why all of the hate for both from each side.  (I mean fans, not the series---they have to hate each other and compete against each other)

If you want to see how this all works, watch Family Guy season 10, episode 21---"Tea Peter"---this is exactly what is going on in the sprint car world right now.  Peter joins the Tea Party movement to kill the governemnt, anarchy ensues, and he "invents" a new "government free" society where everyone just gives some money from their paychecks to support leaders the people select in making decisions that are best for their citizens.............................but at least they're rid of the government................ Same thing.  

At first glance this seems pretty silly.  However, I just watched a Youtube video with Kenny Wallace about how much race car drivers make.  According to him (and I think he'd know better than most of us), there isn't a lot of money to be made.  So some things that I was thinking about reading these responses are things like points payout.  What's the difference between finishing first or second and fifth or sixth?  Sorry I just looked it up.  First pays $250,000, second pays $125,000, fifth pays $80,000 and sixth pays $70,000.  So because of injury he got well doing what he has to do (not snowboarding or something else like that), the team could lose anywhere between $45,000 and $180,000.  To be clear, I don't know how far he could fall or not, it's just a guess.  To us on the sidelines it might not seem like a lot of money when you look at their million dollar rigs and hear about what it costs to run these but as tight as they run their budget this could be catostrophic for a team.  The other thing to think about is, does NAPA or other sponsors give bonuses based on where they finish in the points?  I guess I've never personally heard of "medical provisions" but I don't think it's a bad deal as long as they were hurt racing sprint cars or missing races because of that.

So the biggest points of contention that it seems everyone has here and online are 1) Provisionals in general 2) Sweet and Reutzel potentially extending leads if Rico has a poor finish 3) When they can be used. 

1 - Provisionals are part of racing, get over it. Various series are not going to go away from them, they are here to stay, it does not effect you or your life, and you are no tougher or weaker being for or against them.

2 - Yes it would appear that Sweet and Reutzel could possibly widen the gap if Rico has an un-Rico like race tonight. I'd be willing to bet someone else's house that he probably will finish pretty high so possibly in 24hrs, this arguement will be null and voided. If this happened to be someone who was 8th-12th in points, this point would have flown over everyone's heads so it is something that does not matter until someone wants it to matter. The rules are pretty clear and eveyone knew about it prior to the season which makes finishing strong each night more important. The higher the avg finish, the least amount of points you can lose. The rule does state it is only a 10day period and an extension could possibly be made so during a majority of the season 10days would be around 3 races. In this case, it will probably be 1 for Sweet and TBD for Reutzel depending on results (hoping for just 1 race).

3 - It appears that this cannot be used for just a little sniffle, or a bruise. The rule clearly states you need to be evaluated by a reputable doctor which since the 3 injured drivers left in ambulances leads me to believe that they were not taken to some quack in the back of an alley. This appears to be one of the better solutions as it relates to injured drivers

I agree with Egras on you have to take care of those who take care of you. This is something that many have complained about the WoO with provisionals in general and even with the medical provisional. Now, I do not think in the history of any series, have the top3 in points been injured in 1 race weekend so this is somewhat unprecedented. Another thing to point out is 2 of the 3 were techincally injured in non-series races. Granted, it was a crown jewel of the sport but yet another example as to why WoO has had the rule of x-amount of times teams can race non-sanctioned events. While in theory, yes it would be great that any driver could race whereever whenever they want without penalty, this is one of the many reasons why the rules are the way they are. While I have never been the biggest fan of medical provisionals or waivers (Kyle Busch 2015 championship example), I think this solution is one of the better ones that they have come up with to protect the series, drivers, and teams

Another opinion is that High Limit will continue to operate differently than the Outlaws. 

-Freedom for drivers

-Mid week shows are normal.

-Weeks off during the season

-Franchise ownership / Broadcast revenue sharing

-International races in Australia

-TV broadcasts

-Lots of new fans being brought in by the "NASCAR" guys.

We are just going to have to wait to find out.   

But feel free keep repeating your opinion Ad nauseam because Hoseheads is obviously the place for that.    Predict the future all you want....

You're right-----we will see. Last time was "who said they are going to put together a national tour? This is just an opportunity for guys to make more money during the week"

Maybe this time I'm wrong. 

Also, the HL introduced the Nascar world to sprint car drivers?  I must have been mistaken when I saw Larson, Stewart, and Kahne running WoO shows before the HL was formed......

I don't mind the medical provisionals. It's one of the few Kubota High Limit Racing ideas that isn't a blatant ripoff of WoO or NASCAR and actually improves things a bit. 

WoO is 6 races or 14 days (whichever is shorter) show up points (90) for the driver and the car... The hi limit way is another way, I'm glad both series have a procedure in place so people don't come back too soon from injury. 

If they put a driver in the 49 Tuesday I would suspect that Sweet would not be able to collect points for his personal total. Does anyone know the rule?  Does the car have to stay in the trailer for the main driver to collect medical points? 

Sweet would get the 11th place points, the car would get whatever the car gets at the race if they used a fill in tonight.