Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I agree and disagree...

It seems like it there used to be more passing and excitement, but the racing of today is WAYYYY better than when I was a kid in the 80's (you could guarantee that Sammy, Steve or Doug were winning when they rolled in the gate and starting position made no difference).

Nowadays, you have at least 10-15 cars at most races that are capable of winning.  And more than that at some events.

I'll go a step further and say that more cars now FINISH the race than ever used to in the "glory days" of the 80's and early 90's.  Outside of a car hacing a crash or a mechanical issue on not getting back out on the track, I think the average # of finishers in teh 410 division @ Knoxville this year is over 20 (and the only start 24).  When I was a kid, it was generally around 12-14 finishing out of 24 (that's how much better the equipment is these days).

The bottom line is that Racing (like everything else) is ENTERTAINMENT.  I realise that the racers don't want to be penalized for being fast, but they forget that they benefit on those nights when they aren't fast too.  The only cars that really see zero benefit are those that consistently time 20th or worse (even for weekly shows), and start in the back of every race (not just their heat race).

We could alway scrap time trials and rely on the pill draw for starting position, but that would probably be even more vilified.

You made my point for me: It didn't matter where Steve, Sammy or Doug started. They still won, even if they had to pass the whole field in the process. 

Anyway ... I would scrap time trials in a heartbeat. I like the dual heat race system. Line 'em up and race once, then reverse the lineup and race again. A combination of finishing order and passing points in the two heats sets the main event lineup. And forget the stupid dash, which only further ensures that the fastest cars start the main event up front. 

I remember back in 1984 Keith Kauffman typically started 17th or 18th in the features at Williams Grove because of the invert of the 18 heat qualifers (3 x 6) and that was because he was the point leader (won the track title).  He won a season record 13 races at the Grove that year.  It was more fun watching Keith go through the field than it would have been if he started near the front. 

I fully understand starting 17th, 18th now at the Grove because of the rules, tires, etc. would not be as fair because passing is so much more difficult, but I would still rather watch someone come from around 10th-12th at any track, than the first two rows.

Best racing I've ever seen.

Before I discovered dirt tracks in 1978 my racing diet consisted of nascar modifieds at places like norwood arena, stafford springs, and thompson speedway. The handicapping was quite simple. Whoever had the most money won in the last 3 weeks started 18th. Second most money won 17th, ect. The top dogs always seemed to be able to get to the front in 30 laps. I know that times have changed. But, that said setting fast time and starting on the front rows in todays racing seems to be rewarding the top runners a little too much! A larger invert, or passing points would definately spice up the show, and make for better racing IMO.

did I hear right.  The Kings Royal is a complete invert.  The fastest cars start in rear?

not even close....

In the glory days of the Royal they inverted 6 in the heat race and only the top 3 finishers made the main.

This year they inverted 4 in the heat races (according to the race reports anyway) and top 3 to the feature (6 heats).

The difference between the glory days and today are that you could start 6th in a heat and be leading going down the backstretch in the late 80's and early 90's.  (no different than the Knoxville Nationals, I saw Kinser start 10th and be leading coming out of turn 2 many times in the 80's and early 90's).  Today the equipment is much closer competition wise, which, IMO, is why you hear the constant complaints about inverts these days.

Agree with all. 

An idea for scrapping time trials--use hot laps almost like group qualifying.  For instance--if you are fastest in your hot lap session--10 pts., 2nd fastest-9 points, etc.  Invert your heats accordingly.  (you obviously could not rate the whole field based on hot laps as the track changes rapidly)  Reward for not sandbagging?--cars outside the dash set their starting spots in A and B mains based on their hot lapping points.  ?   Idea anyways.  I know it's not perfect.  I would rather watch 10 laps of Hot laps for each group than an hour of time trials.