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April 18, 2013 at
11:11:37 AM
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06/30/2009
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Just throwing this out there as another perspective.
I have a -12 motor I bought in 1997. It cost around $5500 too $5800 to freshen each year. I run between 25 and 40 races per year on that rebuild. I run in the top ten most of the time and in the top 5 often at Fremont and Attica in Ohio. We have a shot to win every night. I won the first ever F.A.S.T. series race over Chad Kemenah and Tim Shaffer in 2009 with this motor. I spent $90 on tires the last 3 years with the Goodyears, used mainly tires from junk piles of other racers I got for free. The race car along with the Sponsors has paid for itself since 2010.
Granted, I'm not winning any Outlaw races with this deal, but Racing a 410 can be affordable for sure already. I saw a fresh motor just like mine listed in the Classifieds just last week for $8500. I'm not trying to keep up with the Jones' with tons of equipment, I'm just being fiscally responsible and beating a bunch of them on the race track.
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April 19, 2013 at
01:45:39 PM
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08/07/2005
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Well Brian Smith, I am refreshed to hear what you have to say. I like the fact that you know what you have and know where to race with that equipment.
You are the guy I am going to pull for should I get to Attica or Fremont (never been to either, but with 11.7 and 11.3 track records I would guess them to be pretty flat, Driver/setup tracks ).
I write this to bitch on the money that is pissed away every year on elaborate equipment. I will always respect the guy with the old tires and -12 heads running competitively. I always thought thee -12 was a pretty good head.
So I would assume you aren't interested in running some 360 or 305 or a mod or any of those MONEY SAVING classes. You are fortunate enough to compete at 2 of the premier smaller tracks in the heart of the country.
It must be nice to have tires, even someone else’s cast offs, to sort through. It sounds like you must have a handle on your car. That usually takes consistent dedication and plenty of imagination.
I always find it funny the guys that wear there driving suits to the tavern after the races. The ones that have the fact that THEY RACE tatooed on their forheads. The ones with the new Wesmars and fresh J&Js (because Donny Shatz drives one, perfect opportunity for name dropping) but haven't got the smarts or the help (or won't accept the help) to get out of their own way. I guess its in part thanks to them that less financially fortunate teams can have fairly new equipment once those people give up or crash out all together.
I need to ask, do you race with the Outlaws when they are in your neighborhood?
Good luck, I will watch Attica and Fremont results a little closer than I have in the past.
Fastrip
Never start fast projects with half fast ideas!!
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April 19, 2013 at
08:14:00 PM
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06/29/2006
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Rules do not make racing cheaper!! Look at IMCA 8 inch tires and $45,000 "claimer" motors if that whole deal is not the best example of a failed attempt to make racing affordable, Two barrel sprint car motors that run night in night out with the injected motors I think in Petaluma 3 or 4 were in the top 10 at a USAC race. I almost made boat anchors out of my open 360's because I thought the sun was not coming up unless I had a ASCS motor. We ran USAC asphalt and were the only car in the usa to run an all aluminum down nozzle 360 it's to light for a boat anchor! Make it simple open 360's (iron block, alum head, 2-3/16 one mag, dry sump same rules we have had for years) and WOO 410's now engine builders and manufactures have two engines no 305's no 358's no 2 barrel's , 4 barrels just two engines hell someone would have them built in China for 99.99 kidding. flat wings are cheaper to make then dished ok that is good, tire rules are stupid I guess if a brand wants to put money in a point fund you got to run them. The big benifit is there are lots of used motors available at resonable prices and face it most weekend 360 times are running a motor
they bought from the team with the Fetherlite Transporter those guys buy 5-10 new motors a year
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April 20, 2013 at
07:45:27 AM
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08/07/2005
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iq, it sounds like you are quite happy racing a 360. I hope you really enjoy what you do, like I say to a driver on the way out "Have fun, bring it back in one piece". If it isn't fun, and if you are like most the racers I know, you are financing everything you can afford, then why the Hell do you continue putting yourself through the whole racing experience. No results, lack of something that will never let you truly compete, expecting things to improve all by themselves (insanity; doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results). So I really hope you are having FUN!! You know that woody when the engine fires and the buzz when you way overdrive a corner and catch just enough brake and wing to make the corner faster than you ever thought possible (and you marvel at that fact).
I am sorry iq, I need to point one thing out. You say rules don't work and then you say how there should just be an open 360..............with an iron block, aluminum heads, 2.187" injection, one mag, dry sump...................aren't those rules?????????
All I am trying to suggest is to apply some of those same simple basic rules to the 410 formula right off. A few rules work for everybody (choke, choke, there was a time I would not have been able to say that myself). O.K. there are always those blanks between the lines in the rule book that everyone will always try to re-define. I would guess a lot of the competitors come to the track only having seen the plain print and the fast guys live thinking about how to exploit those blank spaces. I am thinking a few of these simple rules would give a lot of garage guys a chance to use their imagination.
Fastrip
Never start fast projects with half fast ideas!!
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April 20, 2013 at
09:14:33 AM
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Thanks for the kind words fastrip. You really should make a trip over here for a F.A.S.T. weekend some time. We have some of the best racers in the country.
I am as low budget as they get, sometimes we are so poor, we can't afford the vowels to spell the word budget, but it doesnt bother me that there are teams willing and able to spend tons of money to race. It's always been that way, always will be. If I had big bucks, I'd do it too honestly. We all do this for fun, but remember, winning is fun.
As far as the 305/360 division deal goes, they don't make any sense to me. The cars and motors cost about the same as a 410 (based on a used -12 410) and the payout is way lower. I personally couldn't afford to keep racing on a 305/360 payout. Besides, I want to be a 410 driver. It's the top division in all of motorsport as far as I'm concerned and I'll keep plugging away trying to stay there.
The Outlaws don't come around here very often, but we'll be giving it a shot at the Brad Doty Classic this year Lord willing.
Here's a year in review from last year you may be interested in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hrBwsC7YOPs
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April 20, 2013 at
11:20:23 AM
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06/29/2006
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agree WOO have rules what I call an open 360 is built according to a "rule Book" I think it is great that the WOO have taken 410 technology from 1985-600 hp to 2013-900 hp that is what racing is about. There is always going to be someone that thinks "if I had that kinda money" thats LIFE not racin, cheer these big money teams on they are why money will flow into our sport. I think it great there were 10,000-13,000 people in Stockton I hope someone made a ton of money. I wish Indy would just adopt F-1 rules and be done with it. The ASCS and IMCA are the best examples of a rule package designed to make racing "affordable" gone wrong,it was a challange for motor builders to figure out how to make 735 HP and not grind out four little letters cast into the heads. 360/410 racing is alive and well in Cali leave the rule changes out of it, just have 2 engine packages nationwide, I love it now they have IMCA Sport Mod's to make affordable mod racing honestly affordable.
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April 20, 2013 at
10:33:10 PM
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Dear Mr. Smith,
I am happy to have heard from you. The link you sent was inspirational to say the least. I am a friend of your sponsor's boss, we talk pretty often.
I see you have been a champion at Fremont (I think it was only Fremont). I have never seen 305 sprint cars race.
Again I have to say, after looking at the points, it's pretty apparent you're using the equipment you have for all it's worth. My hat's off to you.
We are scheduled to make the trip to Eldora May 3-4 for the Outlaws. This will be my son's first trip to Eldora and I haven't been there since the 98 Kings. I need to put my son on the wall (or as close as we can get these days) inside of 3 for hot laps. I may well bitch about the big money engines but that doesn't mean I do not enjoy the experience. That is what I want my son to feel, full out 410 horse power.
We will have to plan a 2-3 day trip to see F.A.S.T. I'll have to do my homework on the Fremont/Attica areas. I will have to check schedules. I would think the end of Ohio sprint week might need to be the plan. Maybe 3 days, Fremont, Lima and Fremont.
Again it's a pleasure to hear from you.
Fastrip
Never start fast projects with half fast ideas!!
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April 27, 2013 at
12:18:30 AM
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Joined:
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06/30/2009
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Posts:
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64
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Picked up the win at Attica tonight.
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