Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I don't think the number of cars that follow the Allstars is that big of a deal. I don't really remember them ever having more than 6 or 7 full time drivers. The problem is now they only race a few times a year instead of having 80 or so scheduled races. Whenever there is a date the Allstars are not racing, the 2, w20, 83, & 0 are at Fremont or Attica racing, so we see them all the time, which makes them no longer a special attraction. Whenever I see that there is an Allstar date on the schedule, that basically tells me I have to pay more to see a regular show.

If I remember right, wasn't there a comment made somewhere about drivers lowering their value and racing for less money? Maybe this just applies to MASS.

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The Posse's over-rated. Take It Easy...

PS Old timers should at least giggle at this, newbies just ignore it...

Personally, I am not privy to all of the politics involved so I will keep this on the facts. Personally, I blame some of the problems at Millstream on the All-Stars (how they qualified each car, which took forever. And the decision to run the dash despite the late hour), not the Roes. I certainly don't want it to appear as though I am defending the Roes, but I blame most of the problems on the people running the show. Now as for Speedweek. John is right that lack of a point fund will not have any effect on who comes to race. There are a lot of races and money to win. What a lack of a point fund does do, is have an effect on staying power. Why run the whole week if there is no point fund? Look at the difference on who raced at Eldora or Millstream compared to who ran at Lima and Fremont. Big difference on some of the heavy hitters.

Looks like president W was smart enough to put out a gag order on this subject. Must not have been able to stand any more quality PR work from this fine "member of the press". Classic.

Got another one for ya. If your beloved series is so wonderful and makes so much money for tracks, why is it that your home track of Knoxville schedules races with the IRA sprints instead of your fabulous "illinois illusion" ?

A slackjawed yokel once told me, "I am assuming your 
just some niave broad who likes to shoot her mouth off 
so I will give you a pass just this once on your 
dipshit comments." 

The Ohio Sprint Speedweek sanctioned by the All Star Circuit of Champions should have a point fund to at least pay out the top three places a little extra cash. To me not having a point fund makes the All Star Circuit of Champions seem very minor league and unprofessional as the sanctioning body of Ohio Sprint Speedweek. I can't believe that I am saying this but I do agree with J.K on one thing. The point fund has very little to do with the car count and the fan attendance, but with that said it is wrong not to have one. Bush league at best. Nuff said!

MSPN that is classic. I'm sure you have no idea who I am based on my user ID but Dad and I are still shooting photos out here in PA if that gives you a clue.

As for the All Star debate, I don't have a dog in the fight but would like to offer my input. I'm 23 years old and have followed racing from day one. The All Stars "premier" days existed before I could really acknowledge the talent from outside PA. That being said, I still remember a time when I enjoyed seeing the ASCoC travel to PA. It gave us a chance to see Kenny and Dean Jacobs, Frankie Kerr, Joey Saldana, Danny Smith, and usually some random driver on the tour that year such as Keith Kauffman in Warren Johnson's U2 or Tyler Walker in the family 35. Those days seem to be gone, or atleast the past several years would indicate a significant downfall. As much as I hate starting up the old "Posse vs. The World" debate, the level of competition that the All Stars bring to PA just isn't up to par. Dale Blaney and Tim Shaffer saved face during the last Williams Grove show by running in the top 10 but for the most part the All Stars have had difficulty even qualifying here. As a fan, why would you want to spend extra money for the same entertainment that you get on a weekly basis? I understand that the economy does not allow some of the teams to travel, but you cannot market a mediocre product and expect to achieve results of years ago.

Additionally, what marketing schemes do the All Stars use to promote their show? Running ads in racing papers and on racing talk shows? Who is that appealing to other than fans already familiar with sprint car racing? To me, who has a degree in Communication Media which encompasses print and broadcast journalism, public relations, and advertising, the goal would be to reach new fans. This is hard to accomplish in dirt track racing. Dirt track racing has relied on repeat fans for decades who bring their families. Once the kids grow up they bring their own families and the cycle continues. The need to reach new people, especially sponsors is crucial to survival. Alienating people by telling them their opinions do not matter or by poor PR skills is the last thing that a series needs. I would love to see the All Stars return to their glory days. I know I don't have the answers or money to make the changes, but a long look in the mirror at some of the recent decisions could help the series.

Son, your Father has forgot more about sprint car racing than most of the people that have posted in this thread know and not just in Posseville. I to remember those All-Star days and I think there are at least two reasons why they have changed. The first being the fact that back then there were about half as many full-time Outlaw teams back then and as a result there were more guys running with Bert Emrick's group who by the way I feel is the second reason. Everybody loved the Emricks, drivers, promoters, fans and car owners and that is not necessarily the case today.

Congrats on getting through school, now go out there and make Dad proud as you no doubt will. Hope you're still not upset with me like you were a few years back when you and a few others bought into the Posse-Outlaw debate a little too seriously. All the best, say Hi to Marty, Take It Easy.....

PS John Katich is not the 'bad' guy he's been painted in this thread, we were friends even though we disagreed on about everything, Lord we used to argue. He doesn't have a mean bone in his body but his choices of sides to be on in a debate can be horrendous. If you ever meet the man I suggest you speak to him, he will not run and hide and you will come away with a much better opinion, I guarantee it. John has simply made two major mistakes in this forum, he went against Emmit Hahn and aligned himself with Guy Webb, OUCH.....

To simply put it, as if all of you haven't realized it already, Katich is a jackass who has lost his way from the trail...

I sure wish he was still commenting on this, but it looks like he has inserted foot into thy mouth. Cuz I sure would LOVE to here him spin about the mutliple bounced checks the All-Stars have issued and about them not paying Arizona Racing T-Shirts, among others.

BIG J

"Luck is what happens when preparation meets opportunity."

Big J- nothing like the entertainment value of the wrecking ball approach, huh?

JK - you are officially invited to the backstretch VIP section if you ever venture to Posse Soil...we love a good meltdown as a sideshow to the racing action...i might even consider picking up the cost of your ticket in the event that you are the deadbeat type who only attends "free" races. we wouldn't want you to get p!ssed off and leave if your credentials don't carry any weight at the gate.

email me if you need directions to PA...many from the mdwest can't find us on a map without assistance.

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

Mike, I didn't set out to attack John. He simply opened(as is his history in doing so) the door for the critisism that he recieved. Everyone is welcome to their own oppinions, but when someone decides to bash or degrade others to prop up their opinion they must understand that some kind of opposition is to come their way.

It's happened to me, you and countless others in this forum over the years and will probably continue to happen in the future. When you group as many people as we have in here together that are as passionate as we all must be, it should be a surprise to nobody.

The reason that John recieves as much of a hard time that he does is because he has put himself into a position where he is expected to be an ambassodor to the sport that we all love. A person in that position is expected to be objective and take a broad view of the overall picture instead of polarizing the fan base.

This is simply my opinion. Please feel free to disagree.

...

Thanks for the congrats Mike although I'm not done yet. I will be attending The Ohio State University to get a Masters Degree in Communication. I've put a lot of the past behind me as I've grown up. It's not unusual for dad and I to travel to see other races outside of PA. We like seeing other groups and drivers. I don't seem to have your e-mail. If you get the chance and don't mind posting it, I would love to catch up with. Later and take care.

For your listening pleasure...41 minutes in...

http://media.dirtmotorsports.com/archive_races/misc/full_throttle/june_30_09.wma

Quite the battle raging here. Just a few thoughts from another paying customer. First, Millstream Speedway should not get another sanctioned race until they make some needed improvements, I've never seen a darker racetrack in my life. The front stretch had three light poles with four lights each, it was VERY dark in some spots. Also, when you have thousands of people at your racetrack to watch speedweek, why do you roll out the 305 sprints first? God it drives me crazy some of the amatures running things. How many of the people there that night came to watch the 305's, yet you run them first. I too left before the a main was run, I believe I walked out at 11:30pm during the third 305 caution and the 410 were not even lined up yet. Got home at 1am and had to work Monday morning. Idiots!

Secondly, I know there was a time when the travelers with the Outlaws were pretty thin, maybe 8-10 full time a decade or so ago, yet the increased purse always brought more local cars. That is what is happening with the All-Stars it seems, Eldora's recent regular All-Star show pulled I think about 40 cars.

Another point, I saw four speedweek shows, great crowds at each race, Eldora, Millstream, Waynesfield, and Lima. Not one track was brave enough to not have support divisions. These are premier events that will pull a good crowd, let's just please see sprint cars, and in between the heats and the c main, instead of rolling junk out there to wear out the track, why not do some track prep to provide a good surface for the premier event?

Attica's WoO race is a great example, jammed grandstands, decent track in heats, then out comes the 20 or so late models instead of working the track to give your biggest race night a decent surface. Thank God for a strong west wind or we would have had to have been dug out from under the dust. How much exactly does 20 late models add to the nights haul? Why can't these people understand the 5,000 or so fans came to see the WoO! How many people would be there to watch those 20 late models? Just run the featured attraction at big shows like that please and give them a good track, trust me, we fans can entertain ourselves during the downtime, and shut the f*&%$#g announcer up and let us talk to each other in between events. I realize the damn concession stands have been open since I got there and don't need him reminding me several times during the night. First time I've been to Attica in three years and will probably be another three. Gas City is the same drive time, need I say more.

Honestly, if we didn't love this sport so much, the monkeys running this deal would kill it. I'm amazed at the bullshit I have to put uo with to watch sprint cars race.

On the bright side, Eldora had the show in the books well before 11 and the track was as close to the way it used to be as I've seen since Tony took over. Lima only had 18 street stocks, after their heats we never saw them again and the show was over early as well. Waynesfield, well Dean tried, the track was rough and too many support classes, but they have the smallest grandstands by far, so he probably needed the backgate. After they fell behind, to their credit they parked the support classes and just ran the sprints until done.

The All-Stars have a great name and loyal fan base. I like their shows except for the stupid dash, never a more useless race in my opinion. Worthless, other than giving those guys a few hotlaps before the feature. Oh, I forgot, six points to the winner. Might as well race for bottle caps boys. Have never had any dealings with Mr Webb so I can't comment. However I would like to see the series back up to a respectable number of shows.

the interview is very good entertainment...particularly minutes 48 - 50...good sh!t...i don't care who you are!

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

Mr. G, Communication degree, how ironic to mention that in this forum, lol. There are more than a few in here that have little if any idea how to communicate, on paper or in the real world. Congrats again!

Slave, no reference to you, John warrants much of the ammo shot his way. Few of the people here attacking him have any idea who he is in real life and would be genuinely surprised at what a nice guy he actually is. Personal attacks by someone on a computer unless for defensive purposes only show a level of intelligence akin to that of a tree sloth anyway. In a hockey connotation, there are quite a few Sean Avery's yakking away, until they here the two most feared words in the game,'Wanna go' As long as John keeps chosing the unpopular side of an argument/debate he will continue to get hammered like Tiger Williams did. However, as Tiger used to say, 'it's not how many fights you win, it's how many you show up for'...

Take It Easy....

obviously Katich got told to shut his pie hole. lol.

I just wander if it was Webb or Dirtvision. That racing show is a pathetic sham - a constant barrage of shit talking against internet race fans.....and the ironic thing is his radio is show is on the internet and for race fans!!!

All the places its supposed to pull its listeners from are the same people he constantly insults.

I love the BS he talked about FAST. If there is ever a threat to his click - that will likely be it. speaking of damage control - it's not damage control to just sit silent - you basically have a dude who has spit in the face of virtually every fan who's bought a ticket to see his pimps show.

Finally - talk about getting a little too secure. When you do nothing but turn everyone against you - just how is the relationships stay so chum? I would think it shameful for anyone to be associated with this fool. But then again - it's not like our sport is really that professional - in the end it probably is a lot more backwoods and hillbilly get er done than most of us would want to admit. when you look at how many series and shows are ran - it's really not that suprising that complete cluck can have his own radio show.....

I myself will never have anything to dow ith anything he is a part of. But it's that way anyway. It only took 2 days of conversation at the 07 360 nationals - I say conversation - it was just hours of anti ascs and 360 - and how 410's will make their comeback and in 2008 the all star thunder through the plains would crush the 360 nat's. Which was lovely that it failed so miserably in that regard - and seeing they couldn't do it on their own 2 feet - Katich and Webb with their "healthy" relationships with the WoO will just suck their tit to the bank.....

So no suprise I came out of that loving ascs more than I already did. And hating ASCoC. Which of course gets mistaken for hating all 410's - seriously I'm just a sprint car fan - I like it all. even micro's (do they count? i hope so). But that is a series of ridin' coattails and 2 unethical dudes livin off a name they did absolutely nothing to create. Such a prestigious name in fact it's going to take them a length of time to destroy it. And you can never underestimate the predictability of stupidity. Not a wise thing to do to spit in the faces of those you hope to buy tickets.

Could anyone argue they burn a lot more bridges than they build?

How much would could a wouldchuck chuck if a 
wouldchuck could chuck would

I couldn't agree more. I listened to his "show" last night to see what the all gifted and knowing Webb would have to say. What I got out of it was the fans should go to the race, buy their tickets, sit in the stands and then wait to be told it was a good show. They shouldn't have an opinion because they don't know anything. Or I loved the comment that Webb made about fans should get a "hobby" or "plant a garden". Maybe those are the new marketing techniques they are using.

I know the intentions of FAST are to help the local guys, but I beleive that if they really wanted to, along with Fremont and Attica, could just about wipe out the All-Stars if push came to shove.

I wonder if the non-sanctioned Chili Bowl has any Media and or Press relation positions available for Mr."my foots caught in my cats kooch" Katich... Hopefully he could help decrease the fan base, as well as the car count, so maybe next year I will only be stuck in Tulsa for 3 days instead of 5... And while he is there, he could pucker up for feature and kiss Emmitt Hahn's Ass!!!!!