This message was edited on
May 27, 2011 at
07:49:42 PM by SBRacing
Reply to:
Posted By: surfnsprint on May 27 2011 at 10:25:38 AM
Excellent points, JayP. In addition, I think the argument that nobody wants to sit through six hours of support classes is flawed. When my wife and kids come to the track, they generally arrive between 7 and 8 pm and sit through three or four Main Events, maybe a B main. They enjoy them all and especially love the kiddie classes if they happened to arrive early enough. Fans is the grandstands is more about the economy and that cold ocean wind! "Just wait till it's a little warmer" my wife keeps telling me this year.
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Mike, I think you misunderstood my comment regarding people sitting through the support classes. My point is, fans of 410 sprint racing grew up on 410 only shows at places like Ascot. They were able to put enough people in the stands and get enough sponsorship to pay really good purses for many years. Many got spoiled watching CRA shows, or Golden State shows up north, when there was either no or only 1 support class.
Me, my father, and my brother started coming to Ventura in the 1980's to watch the Friday night TQ shows, which were awesome. The stands were full back then, and the only support class was the go karts. It was great having the Friday night shows, as we could go to Ascot for the CRA or north to see the Golden State Sprints on Saturdays.
We returned to the track in 1995, helping Chris Wakim with his IMCA sprint car. I think the shows had 4 classes a night even back then, and the stands were pretty full. The shows started later, and ended later- I think the curfew was 11 PM back then. This wasn't as much a sprint car crowd like Ascot would get, but more of a family/friends of drivers crowd coming to root for their favorites in whatever class they happened to be racing in, and politely watching the rest of the show. But still, if you didn't arrive early, you would have to park across the street as the lot would be already full
A few things that changed since then, which may or may not have had an impact on the crowd:
edit- I originally thought that the covered grandstand was still there when we returned in 1995, but I now am sure it was removed a few years before that.
VRA shows in the early 2000's had 3 and possibly 4 classes.
The track stayed tacky all day/night- seeing a water truck, grater, or dust was a very rare occurence.
It didn't cost $5 to park on the dirt lot- It was either $1 or $2 (this was all the Fair Boards doing- Jim could do nothing to stop them when their mind was made up to make more money off of parking)
By 2005, the track surface was nothing close to what it once was, the parking fees were jacked up, and the cover on the grandstand was long gone. Needless to say, you could easily park no matter what time you arrived at the track, and the stands were starting to show signs of becoming emptier.
Then the kids classes were soon added- this was all well and good intentioned especially to get the famlies and kids back involved, but it also made the nights turn into marathons. Instead of being able to show up between 2 or 3 PM, you had to start getting to the track by 11 or 12. With up to 9 divisions and a 10:00 curfew instead of 3 or 4 divisions and a 11:00 curfew, you would spend a ton of time waiting to race, and often get kicked off the track without getting all of the laps in (especially for the support classes).
When the support class drivers had the inclination that the night is running late, and their laps would get cut, the drivers would then try to bonzai to the front- which would often lead to lap shortened, wreck fest stinkers of a race- which turns fans and the drivers off. For the many of us who remember the awesome track surfaces of years gone by, seeing the track slick off and get dusty during the heat races, then seeing the water truck and grater coming out was not really a welcomed site. Sure the track would be alot better than it was earlier, but why did it come to having to have an hour break to prep the track in the middle of the show???
Then after adding the kids classes and doing a fantastic job of quickly building them up, they took the points away from the mini dwarf classes- and the car counts dwindled quckly. I know they took the points away due to the overzealous and competitive nature of the parents, but it is those parents who brought the kids to the track. Now Ventura is lucky to have 10 minis in the pits, while Bakersfield speedway (where points are awarded) often have more than 30- just as Ventura used to.
So the point to my long winded diatribe here- Sure the economy is hurting everyone from the racers to the fans, and most importantly, the tracks themselves. But the decline at Ventura was already starting more than 5 years ago. From reading the boards, to sitting in the stands and talking to fans, to being in the pits and talking to the drivers, there are many things making people take their hard earned dollars somewhere else, not just the economy. The dwarf car class at Ventura has shrunk to barely half its previous size in the past few seasons. Most of it is not due to the economy.
There are many things that need to be done to improve the state of all racing in California- we as fans, drivers, car owners, sponsors, and track promoters need to really, truly listen to each other, and help each other make this turn around. In this age of easy information sharing- we can take all the constructive ideas and thoughts being represented here and other places, and it will help make it better. Seeing Chris Kearns, Steve Quercio, Scott Woodhouse, and Scott Schweitzer all posting and listening to the fans on the internet, is truly a breath of fresh air- and even though it is probably frustrating at some points for them, it is greatly appreciated by most everyone.
So in closing, I disagree- I do not take 98% of what is posted here as whining or complaining. Most all who post here really love this sport and do all they can to support what they love. We as a support class race team, love sprint car racing, and racing in general so much that we decided to get a car we could afford and help to put on the show. We love Ventura Raceway and do not want to see it go away. thats why we scrape our pennies together all season and try to make as many shows as we can throughout the season.
But something does need to change there, beyond just lowering the purses, to get Ventura Raceway back to where Jim had it for so many years in the past.
Joe Sadowski- SBRacing # 15
2010 VRA Pro Dwarf Champion with Driver Angel Figueroa
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I have noticed dust bowls at just about every track I've been to especially lately. I don't blame the guys at Hanford, it was warm and breezy and they probably should have watered the track more, but hey, it was one helleva race.
Ventura has had both dust bowls and mud pits but on average the track is really racey and good.
I have read everyone's posts and to me everyone has valid points. I do feel for Mr. Naylor, but he's going through what all other track owners or promoters are going thru.
I love open wheel racing. Silver Crown, Sprints (410s, 260s, 302 carb-I love them all), Midgets, TQs, Mini Sprints (or whatever they are called now Lightning Sprints), modifieds, anything open wheel. I think this is where the problems begin.
The open wheel fans want to see just that, open wheel cars. The stock car people want to see stocks. Personally, I think if the promoters would run open wheels w/open wheel support divisions and late model stocks w/stock car support divisions, the fans would be happier. I love racing no matter what is racing. I've been to many different types from stocks to mods to sprints. For me, if it's got a fast engine and 4 wheels (sometimes 2) I'm down for it. I do realize that there are others who do not share my love of all types of racing.
At Perris, when we have a stock car support, it's almost as if the fans are divided. The sprint car fans don't want to sit near Stock car fans and vice versa. I wonder why? I realize that the hobby stocks and pony stocks don't go fast but seriously people, have you watched the mods or the late models? They run close to what a sprinter does.
I have a challenge to everyone here. Why don't you go to support your track, Ventura, Perris, Victorville (my personal fave) on a night that your fave division isn't running? Everyone is saying how we need to support our local tracks, well, don't you think it's put up or shut up time? How about bringing your friends and/or neighbors who don't know what a sprint car is or haven't been to any racing in awhile? What would be great would be to have a family pack of tickets for a set price, offer ALL military discounted prices not just the active member, offer senior prices or have a special night like buy 1 way in and get 1 in free? Why not do this to get more people in the seats and make fans out of them. I know the promoters are going to say, we've done this before. Yeah, well you've all had to raise prices when unemployment is higher than it's been in one helleva long time. People are living on unemployment, welfare, pensions or using their savings. I think we all need to help each other.
This is just my opinion and we all know what that's worth. I try every week to bring new people to the track or get people who haven't been in a long time back to the track. For Perris, the most common complaint is the prices. For Ventura it's the drive. So far, when people are free they will make the trek to Victorville and they say it's due to the great prices on the admission, the fact that we all get home at a decent hour and that they keep the action going. One friend said that usually intermissions are the hardest for her because of her kid, however, with Steve Q. having the jet fire truck melt down a car kept his interest and he wasn't bugging Mommy to go home.
Sorry this is a book, but I see everyone complaining but very rarely do I see someone try to come up w/a solution.
RIP Chet and Mark. You might be gone but never will
be forgotten.
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