Forum: Oklahomatidbits.com General Forum (go)
Moderators:  /  David Smith Jr

John

I see the point you are making and I do agree with it to a point. However, have you seen a limited race at Brill's? Since the car count numbers have risen in the last few weeks the racing has been awesome. Last week they had a battle for the lead with three cars right up to the end. I have talk to some 2 barrel winged owners and they have said if Brill would increase the purse in the class then they would build a limited sprint. The car owner I spoke to said the winged cars are becoming locked down. Yes, I have been to two OCRS races this year as well. Fans want to see racing and not follow the leader.

I am a fan of sprint car racing as a whole. But what is happening is your getting a separation of the haves and have nots. In today's OCRS/ASCS world some people would have a hard time getting the money together to run those series. You said that the Brill two barrel cars are the low budget guys. While some of them are. I would bet that the front runners have anywhere from 8000 to 12,000 in their motors. Some of the OCRS guys I would bet have at least 10,000 to 15,000 in theirs.

What this limited class is good for are those guys that do not want to run 2 barrel winged sprints. I know you are a supporter of the OCRS. It is also good for those guys that just want to race a sprint car without spending a huge amount of money. When Jeff's performance was building motors they told me that they could build a limited motor for around 4000.

"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands 
in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he 
stands at times of challenge and controversy." 
Martin Luther King, Jr. 

Erich Petersen 

I know that we're talking about limited $4,000 motors. But I saw this and thought that it pertained to the conversation. I like the idea, and if you build a 2 barrel from the ground up by yourself you're looking at about $10,000. For just $5000 more you could run a 410.http://www.openwheel.org/ls.html.

As I reply, I want to first state that I am in no way arguing with you, Ed or anyone, just spewing out my view points based on what I was reading the last couple of days. (Seen too much bickering on message boards to last 5 lifetimes. I wont go that route.)

I wont doubt there was a 3 way battle for the lead at the finish of a race as described. However, doesn't mean I would jump up and down over choked down cars. I can go see mini stocks race that close but that doesn't do anything for me either (no offence stock drivers )

There will ALWAYS (and I mean ALWAYS) be have and have nots. Hypothetically, if any class of sprints got to have 25-30 cars or more, your ALWAYS going to have the haves and the have nots. Just the way it goes. Someone's ALWAYS going to out spend the other guy within whatever rules you give them.

So BJ, when you buying one of those 410's?

It would be nice to have a civilised topic here on tidbits, keep it up.

David Smith Jr.
www.oklahomatidbits.com

I am not sure what type crate motor it is but there is serious talk that IMCA is going to a crate motor for the sport mods in 2011. Cost is no more than $6500 I believe it is. The stuff like that seems to be the way to go but it all also boils down to having it policed to keep everybody in line. I miss watching the outlaw 410 sprinters and the ASCS type 360 seems to be staled car count wise.

My opinion is something needs to be done in all forms of dirt track racing because it isn't looking too good.

David Smith Jr.
www.oklahomatidbits.com

Jon, I did not think you singled out Brill's. I just brought out Brill's because I am more familair with the drivers and cars there than Lawton and Creek.

I am curious as if anyone had a stopwatch on Passmore last night at Muskogee.

A couple of us have put our heads together and came up with what we thought was a number for the winged two barrel sprints. We figured there are about 50 to 60 in the state.

David, I agree policing the rules is the whole matter at hand in keeping costs down.

"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands 
in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he 
stands at times of challenge and controversy." 
Martin Luther King, Jr. 

Erich Petersen 

There are over 100!

Jon

I just like to pick your brain and if you have been on here long enough you know I do allot of what ifs.

In one of your posts you said that the only fans that would come out to watch the e-sprints would be family members correct? Last night, as you can see by reading the Brill post, I sat next to some fans and they told me that they liked the e-sprints b/c they seemed to be equal to one another. Those fans I spoke with are general racing fans. The husband also helps on a pro stock. They also went to the Fairgrounds quite regularly.

Like you I want racing to survive in the state. However, in order for it to we have to inject new blood into the sport. Do you not agree? What would you say the breakdown of ages were with the OCRS guys? Do you have a general balance between younger guys and older guys? Off the top of my head thinking about the e-sprint car of the 8 or 9 cars that general run at Brill's I would say it is about half half.

I think, in my opinion, we need something for the entry level guys. Such as myself. Would I like to run OCRS or ASCS yea for the fun of it. But, I am not looking at breaking the bank if you know what I mean.

You do not see allot of 410 guys walk in off the street and get in a car. The majority of them have started in lower divisions that were slower.

"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands 
in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he 
stands at times of challenge and controversy." 
Martin Luther King, Jr. 

Erich Petersen 

David:

There are two choice for IMCA Northern Sport Mods which is currenty the largest between Northern or Southern IMCA cars.

The Northern Sprot Mod can either run a 9-1 compression ratio motor or they can purchase a Crate motor from Chevy that costs around 3800 bux shipped in. I have a mixed field here. Most are building their own motors but there are a few that have put the crate motors in their cars. There is also a chip that limits rev's on the Crates and it is around 6500 I think. Anyway these motors are lasting and are good stuff from Chevy factory..

Ed Beckley
Dodge City Raceway Park 
Dodge City, Kansas 
www.dodgecityraceway.com 
[email protected] 

Also Enid Speedway 
Facebook http://www.facebook.com/people/Enid-
Speedway/100001203768363 

Ed,

What is your car count in the sport mods?

"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands 
in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he 
stands at times of challenge and controversy." 
Martin Luther King, Jr. 

Erich Petersen 

I believe your taking my comment about "nobody but family members" just a little to literally. Sure there may be one or two here in there, but in terms of percentages, most sprint car fans dont want to see a sprint car division that's paramount to the bottom rung of a stock car class.

What I cant understand, I know you are aware what the speeds (lap times) are for the current 360 2 barrel teams that typically run in the back of the pack now. Not to speedy are they? And you want to see those motors chocked down more? As I stated earlier, I respect your right (and/or anyone else's) to want that. Its just not for me. I wouldn't drive 2 miles to watch something that slow in a sprint car chassis. In fact, it would make me cringe. As for the cost to get out and race, the teams I just mentioned wont save a plugged nickle on an e-sprint vs what they are trying to race now. That's just a fact.

In closing, enjoy what you like to watch. Not everyone likes the same thing all the time. Im also not one to keep going round and round on a single topic on a message board. Gets to monotonous for me. If you see me at the track sometime and want to address this or any topic over a beverage, Im more than willing to chat racing anytime.

Cheers

John Lemon

Sooner Circles @hoseheads.com

I can't help but agree with ever post KOP (John) has put on here the last couple of days.

Cheese I watched both of those vids - I really hope a few tracks and maybe even a series pops up out of that. Thats extremely interesting. Guys could basically run what sprints should be - freakin fast! - for the price some are spending on 305's and micro's. It's a terrific idea. The only thing I question in it was when Schatz was talking - just hit a brick wall when speaking of who would build and police/regulate it. As a fan I don't understand it myself, but are there reasons motor builders don't want to do this? I can see it to a degree - they probably make more off the 25-35-45k motors. But if you think long term - you won't make more with the high end motors....it would be with something like the LS right?

Just seems like that is one of best alternatives I have heard yet - splitting cost in half but yet not giving up much power. It's f-n perfect. And I think John is echoing much of the same logic - why sacrifice speed in cutting cost if you don't have to?

I hope someone really develops ideas like the LS. But it seems some favor making roley polies out of sprint cars instead.......

How much would could a wouldchuck chuck if a 
wouldchuck could chuck would

Cody

I never said I wanted less speed. What I was trying to get people to understand is the cutting the cost. I might not have echoed that in great detail.

Someone told me about a 305 motor that was being bulit for on the 15 to 20 grand range.

"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands 
in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he 
stands at times of challenge and controversy." 
Martin Luther King, Jr. 

Erich Petersen 

i had a watch on the b features they were running 20.5 and then in the features leaders were running around 21.5 at the beginning i quit timing them after that and just watched. I'm not a sprint car fan... actually i pretty much despise them. But that was the best sprint show ive watched. Most of my experiences are from races at outlaw.