Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I can't tell if you have confused me with someone else, or I'm just not explaining myself well enough. I'm not a big fan of the WoO. I feel that over the years, the WoO has caused the decline of local sprint car racing. On top of that, their programs have mostly stopped being about competitive racing and more about being an "event". If people like that, good for them. I don't much care for it.

The lawyer comment isn't about HL. It's about HL's charter idea. I feel it's too vague, will be very complicated and will cause legal issues among owners. Think this through. You're going to see teams chasing an undetermined pot of gold. When they get there and it's not what they expected, what happens? Another example. Your team right on the border between 4th and 5th in points. 4th equals pot of gold, 5th equals sad trombones. What happens when there's a call that doesn't go your way? Recall the race where Sheldon got out of his car and threw his helme because he didn't get to restart the race. Soon you'll be filing an appeal to the ruling or wha they call that in NASCAR.

Calling someone a homer or whatever is counterproductive to any serious discussion. I guess Ill just ask if you don't follow where I'm coming from, ask and I'll explain if that's what it takes to keep things civil. We're on this forum because we have a common bond of liking to watch sprint car racing. please don't paint with such a broad brush that we lose that focus.

To answer your first question....no, especially on this board. Guys like Murphy and FIXXXER, and a few others, are such huge Outlaw homers that anything the HL series announces or tries to promote, they instantly turn it around and claim it's being done for pure greed/money and come up with these fairytale scenarios in order to bash them (for example,"each team will have to hire their own lawyer" .... question: can their newly-hired lawyers wash the car, change tires, sweep the trailer, clean the trailer toilet, etc when they are not locked in some hypothetical courtoom "battle" somewhere?) 

When in fact, reality is hitting them in the face and they can't stand it. Even though several good teams have not announced still, HL's roster is already better than the WoO, and they know it. HL has the reigning WoO and All Star champs, Rico, the white 57 for maybe half the races - with the 57 being one of the top rides in the country, and many others. They hate the fact that the WoO limits their drivers to just 4 races outside the series, one of the dumbest rules in sprint car racing.

HL teams can run as many as they want, and I can't wait until one of the HL teams goes in and wins a WoO crown jewell race, Can't wait.

They are also upset that several WoO employees were receptive enough to be hired away by HL including the best race director in the business and their number 2 announcer.

You guys will drum-up any bs fairytale just to try to make HL look bad, when deep down inside you know they will be successful.

- Just my opinion -

I'm not an outlaw homer at all. I'm not a posse homer either and I live here. I actually don't give a shit about any geographical/series affiliations etc. As I've said, these guys hate the WoO 4 race rule so much yet do some research on how many times any of these guys have used one of their freebies prior to 2023. Hardly EVER. So I hear what they're saying but past actions paint a different picture. I also don't understand why High Limit had to buy the All Stars and basically dismantle 80% of the series instead of just expanding their existing series itself. Why destroy the All Stars? I'd love for Brad or Kyle to answer that one question honestly. But I guarantee you they never will because it would ruin the Robin Hood vibe they're selling. I also know what very trusted people who are right in the middle of the situation have told me about a lot of the shit that's been going down that you'll never read about in a press release. I keep my word and I refuse to betray my friends so I would never divulge any of it to anyone even if they offer me a charter. But I know what I know. And a lot of it is classless as hell.

I am surprized that WoO were not sued. I would say the race teams are independent contractors. Free to sell their services where and to whomever they want.

It would be nice to know about the financials and restrictions the series owners and tracks have. Of course would one believe any of them?

I'm not an outlaw homer at all. I'm not a posse homer either and I live here. I actually don't give a shit about any geographical/series affiliations etc. As I've said, these guys hate the WoO 4 race rule so much yet do some research on how many times any of these guys have used one of their freebies prior to 2023. Hardly EVER. So I hear what they're saying but past actions paint a different picture. I also don't understand why High Limit had to buy the All Stars and basically dismantle 80% of the series instead of just expanding their existing series itself. Why destroy the All Stars? I'd love for Brad or Kyle to answer that one question honestly. But I guarantee you they never will because it would ruin the Robin Hood vibe they're selling. I also know what very trusted people who are right in the middle of the situation have told me about a lot of the shit that's been going down that you'll never read about in a press release. I keep my word and I refuse to betray my friends so I would never divulge any of it to anyone even if they offer me a charter. But I know what I know. And a lot of it is classless as hell.

WOO does not stop anyone from racing any where they want. Non compete clauses have been in business and employment contracts forever.

Welcome to America, you can rull all the Woo races if you want and not sign the contract, just don't expect tow money or point fund. It is that simple. 

All I am looking at from my perspective in east central Minnesota is how this will affect our local WoO races.  They're the only one of the two that comes up here so I am not taking sides, just waiting to see if I want to plop down $45 or $50 to see what they're going to put on the track. 
 

By way of example a couple years ago a track up here scheduled an Outlaw race.  The scene hasn't changed a whole lot since I was chasing them with a camera.  I looked at their scheduled race, noted that they were going up against a NOSA show in the Dakotas, an IRA show a few hundred miles east of us and Knoxville weekly.  The first thing I thought was where in the hell do they expect to draw any cars from?  I opted not to go but watched on Dirtvision and there were teams dragging spare cars out of their haulers to get up to 17.  A couple local cars I'm pretty sure had 360's so my guess based on past experience was spot on.  
 

What did the WoO have last year, around 12-14 travelers?  My simple math tells me that fourteen divided by two is seven and that every team with the funding could have joined the WoO tour but the number stayed constant from year to year somewhere in the low teens.  When High Limit races in the Texas and Oklahoma area I understand there aren't many 410's down that way either.  We have enough cars to run some decent special events with IRA, Knoxville, Husets and NOSA drivers but not so much when they're all racing on the same night. 

I expect that we will see those kinds of dates on both schedules where they struggle with car counts in some areas.  The idea that both series can provide a quality product at every stop doesn't match the math.  14 WoO cars divided by 2 = 7, not 28 like some seem to think.   This looks like a good year to hang back and let all this sort itself out.  My neighbors just announced that they're moving up to 410's this year so it will be fun to follow their progress wherever they decide to race.  

Hi Stan, is that Luke Nellis that is moving up? Not often you hear someone from this part of MN saying they're jumping to a 410. 

The Outlaws are wrong.  They need to stop the 4 race thing. Let the owners and drivers decide where they want to race.  Especially if it doesn't affect their outlaw schedule.

LOL.... Details matter.   With High Limit, you are free to race with the Outlaws at the crown jewels, but it is not like you have schedule freedom.   If you want to be one of the lucky ones with a charter, you still have to have 100% perfect attendance at all High Limit shows for two years.   

Ok, fair enough. When I read your original post it came across as all anti-HL. Some of your scenarios are quite a stretch, wouldn't you agree?

So many posts on here just bash HL up oneside and down the other, and then you have a few "straphangers" (what the military calls people just tagging along) who "agree". Apparently I'm the only fan of what High Limit is trying to do and who willing to wait to see how things go on this board, and apparently the only one brave enough to fight back.

If you are not an outlaw homer, and you say you're not, I apologize. Many on here bashing HL are.

Yes but you can race as much as you want.  Not just 4 races without penalty like the woo.  That is a lot more freedom.  

I will say it again.  The woo is wrong!

Where is the freedom from HL? They just said you have to run 100% of the HL races for 2 years to be able to get a Charter. Sounds like they are mandating what races the teams run. A HL team can not go run another show if a HL show is scheduled. Sounds the same to me.