Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I love non-wing racing also but see "Mopar Million" as to who can run with who.

"You'd be fortunate to get half the crowd even if you had a better car count. People will not show up to Knoxville for a 360 only show, period."

Unfortunately, I think you are absolutely right. Some more of that 410 snobbery that I personally just don't understand.

Hey, here's a thought. What if the Outlaws did away with displacement limits entirely or raised them to something like 565 cu. in. What would happen to 410 racing/crowds then?

I think the WoO would have a tough time selling tickets for a 12 car race. LOL

I agree with Lefty.

No surprise that Jac won that deal, I'd seen him run at Manzy without a wing more than a few times, and as you know he's fearless. I'd also seen Stevie run their when he was a rookie in 99 with the outlaws and you could tell he was on his way. If you remember Stevie had put on a big right rear that people said wouldn't work...they were wrong! The good one's are just that, good.

Half the lies they tell about me aren't true. 

Sing it Ref! Sha Na Na Sha Na Na - you know the rest!

The Ref is gone and 360's are following him.

Say what? The hammer falls both ways. The guys in USAC and CRA get their butts handed to them by the WoO when they run under a wing. The best sprint car drivers have always gravitated to the WoO because that's where the money is. Given the time to adapt, I have little doubt the top WoO drivers would soon dominate the wingless crowd.  After all, slowing down is easier than speeding up! And history is on my side. 

Screw the 410s. Definitely screw the 360s. SOD runs open cubes. So do the late models.

SOD tire rule and Doty wing angle rule is all that is needed.

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

And you'd be wrong this year.  There is a brand new LS motor running that I'm told cost north of $50k.  It was build by  Baldwin Racing Engines.  They say it makes over 900 HP.  It won the last race. 

In Texas, we formed the www.SprintCarBandits.com series 3 seasons ago and all we 'changed' on the cars to free them up, drastically reduce tire wear and reduce engine stress was a couple small things that 2 crew guys can take literally 15 minutes to perform, at an essential cost of $0.

And, of course, we've had a handful of naysayers from Day 1 - that I call the 'vocal few' (but what thing in life doesn't have naysayers when there's change). But we rarely hear from those naysayers any more.

Here's basically all there is to it:

-We have a 'one rear tire all night' rule and it hasn't changed in 3 years. We've yet to have one team lose a tire due to that rule yet.

-Our wing angle rule (20 degrees) helps to free up the car, reduce tire wear and engine stress.

-We have restricted stagger a few inches by enforcing the LR tire. That helps free up the car even more.

-We allow both common RR tires, which sell anywhere from $159-179, which is a drastic decrease in price over the RR tires of the past. Same thing goes for the front tires, which teams are paying between $115-130 each for.

All these things have let to consistently better racing because drivers can race their cars and pass easier on different track sizes and conditions. And the tire rule helps keep more budget teams competitive - and on the track instead of at home on race night, as they are now consistently saving upwards of $300/night on tires...which is a huge missing link to the economics of sprint car racing from the 90's and today.

That last item is very important, as many tracks can't afford to book full size purse events as it is, and those purse structures don't match up to modern day economics for the teams. So, by wedging in these small edits, it effectively has straightened a lot of the problems out...as racers get to take home more of their purse money than spending it on consumables and keeps them heading to the next event down the road. (Our series overhead is also very low, so that helps from a track expense standpoint.)

Here are some quotes from seasoned sprint drivers down here after they've ran with the Sprint Car Bandits, consistently, the past few season:

25+year veteran sprint car driver, Claud Estes III comments: "The Sprint Car Bandits rules have kept the competitiveness level much more in check between sprint teams of nearly all budgets. Plus, it has made 360C.I. racing much more affordable, and that's why our family supports the series. I think it's been fantastic, and we get to compete for excellent purses at every event. Guys feel like they have a fighting chance at a good performance from track to track because they're not being out-budgeted thanks to the Sprint Car Bandits series rear tire rules and wing angle rules. We saved a lot of money just in tires competing with the Series the past two season."
 

Estes continues: "As a matter of fact we recently picked up two more 360C.I. engines, as even my brother Daniel plans to resume racing sprint cars because of what he's seen in the Series. So there will be nights when there will be four Estes cars in the pits at Sprint Car Bandits events in 2018."

2016 SCB runner-up in series points, Junior Jenkins comments: "We are a budget conscious team, and since we started racing with the Sprint Car Bandits at the beginning of last year, we have noticed a sizable difference in our net nightly cost vs. earnings, and it has helped keep us on the track. Plus, I feel it has substantially closed the gap in the competition, giving more drivers a fighting chance."

Fan and track promoter comments have been consistent with driver comments and have been equally supportive.

The whole bottom line to all of this is, there are some simple things that can be done like what we are doing...or like SOD, or UMSS are presently doing. It just all comes down to actually doing it.

Or, there's always the option of just sitting back and complaining about it until the problem just gets worse and worse…which appears to be what is going on in many cases across the nation.

And the best part is, collectively, our simple solutions have nothing to do with telling someone they need to buy this or buy that and make a proclamation that 'this will fix the problem down the road.'

And, it’s not cubic inch related. We’ve even had a couple features won by smaller engines…which makes our Series even more appealing to a wide range of sprint teams.

This essentially helps fix a lot of it. And now. Not later.

In your individual areas, just try to point your local tracks or series to simply try our rules package one night. It’s not like they have to pay anything or join anything to do it. Just try it and see if you get results like this, and help get sprint car racing back ‘on track.’

  ASCS 360 - $50,000

  WoO 410 - $70,000

  ASCS rebuild after 18-22 shows with average rebuild if nothing is wrong $7- $7,500

  WoO rebuild 8-10 shows $9,500 - $10,000

Thanks  dmantx........(two posts up^)      Who was it that said the thought of limiting stagger was a bad idea? 

Nice work with the Sprint Bandits. What motor is in that 55 car? Is that the CT525 by chance? People will continue to complain and debate until there is no more sprint car racing left. The solutions can be so incredibly simple (not to deny your group proper credit) but the "money" teams and drivers want nothing to do with it. Reducing traction saves tires, motors and driveline wear and tear, it is truly that simple. Our sport is DYING and only a few have stepped up to do anything about it. UMSS, Sprint Bandits, RUSH, SOD and Racesaver seem to have good things going. The 604 motor the wingLESS sprints run seems to be a good option too althought it is a bit more expensive.

Maybe it's time the spoiled "money" teams took their "toys" and went home. Maybe then the rest of the world can get back to racing again!

What wing rule does SOD run? I looked and I don't see anything different than most other series.

Nothing different than most other series.

.  

Why did someone resurrect a 7 year old thread?

SOD tire rule and Doty wing angle rule is all that is needed.

http://www.mrn.com/Media-Center/MRN-Show-Archives/Winged-Nation.aspx

 
 
 
They don't even know how to spell sprint car 
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com

It was located at the bottom of the forum page when I scrolled down.  

It is always fun to bring the Ref back to show how far off he was.

Been wondering the same thing everytime I see a new reply....