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Topic: Port Royal Improvements/2020 Opener Email this topic to a friend | Subscribe to this TopicReport this Topic to Moderator
Page 2 of 3   of  47 replies
Curious12
November 17, 2019 at 07:48:28 AM
Joined: 09/10/2017
Posts: 69
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Williamsgrove is nice but can do some improvements to be better. Crowd size is smaller each year and a shame

Go back to 730 start time. Many travel hours to get there and hours to get home. Shows run very late. They have quite a few 730 starts and drivers are there. Never saw that it made a difference to car count

No second division on big races or time trial races. Shows seem to run late enough.  Track is also big enough to run multiple cars for time trials. The most boring part of racing. 

Better food. Pizza is awful and cold on front stretch

AGREE Get cars out of infield for a better view fan experience

 



fiXXXer
November 17, 2019 at 12:22:16 PM
Joined: 10/26/2014
Posts: 2011
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Posted By: longtimefan on November 17 2019 at 06:45:45 AM

And where do you think the Fairboard gets the money? It doesn't grow on trees. I know it is the Juniata County Agricultural Society but I am pretty sure they don't grow money. If they do I wish they would share the secrete. I would switch 120 acres of corn and soybean ground to one hundred dollar bills next year.  In years past when the track wasn't as successful the money did not majectly appear from the Fairboard. I has to made on the track.  . They have no more access to grants than any other active fair in the state and as said the detratctors over estimate how many of the improvements are paid for that way. Also with all government funding they come with strings attached that make the projects cost more so although $100,000 in grant money helps it does not cut the project cost by $100,000 because the contractors for instance for the tunnel project add some to their bid because they know the government inspectors will have them doing some unneccesary things that would not be done on a privately funded job. That's just government. And another thing if another track were to build a handicapped accessible tunnel for instance, I am pretty sure with some ambition they could get some assistance with it. It happen at many public venues.



Literally no one ever said any of that. Did you actually read the post? Other active fairs get grant money too but I never said a word about that. I know how the grant process works and I know how the contractors add to their bids. My father worked in local government for most of my life. My point is if Port builds something, does Steve O'Neal have to spend a dime of his own money? No. If the same thing happens at Lincoln does Jerry Parrish, Scott Gobrecht or Mike Heffner have to spend their own money? Yes. Unless a sponsor steps up and helps or something along those lines, it's their personal wealth being spent. I'm not bashing Port Royal or delegitimizing things they do. What I'm saying is I'm tired of the people who beat the other tracks down with what Port Royal has done. After decades, Port finally got the right people in place and I appreciate that. But their situation is a lot different. Furthermore, one thing I didn't even mention is that Port makes a good bit of money off the fair itself. The other tracks don't have a fair every year so that's yet another built in advantage they have. Again, this isn't me talking shit about Port Royal. I loved the place when it was a dump and I love it now. 



Centralpa410
November 17, 2019 at 12:59:10 PM
Joined: 12/06/2015
Posts: 89
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Reply to:
Posted By: longtimefan on November 17 2019 at 06:45:45 AM

And where do you think the Fairboard gets the money? It doesn't grow on trees. I know it is the Juniata County Agricultural Society but I am pretty sure they don't grow money. If they do I wish they would share the secrete. I would switch 120 acres of corn and soybean ground to one hundred dollar bills next year.  In years past when the track wasn't as successful the money did not majectly appear from the Fairboard. I has to made on the track.  . They have no more access to grants than any other active fair in the state and as said the detratctors over estimate how many of the improvements are paid for that way. Also with all government funding they come with strings attached that make the projects cost more so although $100,000 in grant money helps it does not cut the project cost by $100,000 because the contractors for instance for the tunnel project add some to their bid because they know the government inspectors will have them doing some unneccesary things that would not be done on a privately funded job. That's just government. And another thing if another track were to build a handicapped accessible tunnel for instance, I am pretty sure with some ambition they could get some assistance with it. It happen at many public venues.



This is spot on and I was just about to say the same thing. Port may have received a grant for a handicapped accessible tunnel but they didn't receive a grant for lights, for a new concession stand, the catch fences, the tractor pull, widing the front stretch, track surface, the new grandstand, the pit grandstand, the expanded pit area, the volunteers, the list literally goes on and on and on. 

whether the Juniata county fair pays for it or if it comes out of a track owners pocket, it's still money that was earned by the hard work of the Fairboard. The money was raised and earned. Obviously there are many sponsors port reached out to for the new signage. 

so it is a fair playing field. The Fairboard makes money and they reinvest. WG and Lincoln and Selinsgrove all make money too or they wouldn't be open. 

selinsgrove is owned by a Fairboard too. 

I go to all 4 tracks, mainly Port, but yes, the other tracks should do more. Selinsgrove is at least trying. Lincoln video board is a nice touch but imo not needed. 




beezr2002
November 17, 2019 at 05:03:25 PM
Joined: 04/21/2017
Posts: 216
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Reply to:
Posted By: Centralpa410 on November 17 2019 at 12:59:10 PM

This is spot on and I was just about to say the same thing. Port may have received a grant for a handicapped accessible tunnel but they didn't receive a grant for lights, for a new concession stand, the catch fences, the tractor pull, widing the front stretch, track surface, the new grandstand, the pit grandstand, the expanded pit area, the volunteers, the list literally goes on and on and on. 

whether the Juniata county fair pays for it or if it comes out of a track owners pocket, it's still money that was earned by the hard work of the Fairboard. The money was raised and earned. Obviously there are many sponsors port reached out to for the new signage. 

so it is a fair playing field. The Fairboard makes money and they reinvest. WG and Lincoln and Selinsgrove all make money too or they wouldn't be open. 

selinsgrove is owned by a Fairboard too. 

I go to all 4 tracks, mainly Port, but yes, the other tracks should do more. Selinsgrove is at least trying. Lincoln video board is a nice touch but imo not needed. 



+1. Very good points for the uninformed



racer goin broke
November 17, 2019 at 06:25:07 PM
Joined: 03/02/2016
Posts: 105
Reply

It was $1.3 million dollar grant for the tunnel and new bathroom correct?

Another person said about a contractor for the tunnel job?  Is there a contractor for the tunnel job?   If there is; then the job should have been put out for public bid.    If it was put out for public bid then there is public record  what companies bid?  Does getting government money mean a job should be put up for bid? Maybe I will call my local politician and put his ass to work and give me the explanation on how grants work.  And if contractors need hired.  As a Pennsylvania taxpayer I like to know where every nickel of my hard earned money is going and how it is spent.

And if anyone knows about construction it will not even come close to costing 1.3 million if  the track and volunteers are doing the work.

Because  isn't the track is doing all the work?



bigbrad115
November 17, 2019 at 07:13:42 PM
Joined: 03/03/2007
Posts: 11
Reply

I have no knowledge of what finantial gains or losses the speedway has amassed. But this how I see it...

If there was a grant, It was for the CONSTRUCTION of the tunnel and restrooms. Maybe the track is saving some money by doing the DEMOLITION of removing the old tunnel and stage with track employees and volenteers.  




RodinCanada
MyWebsite
November 17, 2019 at 08:53:08 PM
Joined: 07/24/2016
Posts: 811
Reply

I know you PA fans are passionate and have a favorite track which you would like to see be the elite facility in your state so I understand the discussion but truthfully, shouldn't we all just be super glad money is being invested in the sport we mutually love? I think money spent at one will create money spent at the next and all will benefit unless the people in charge either dont care, cant afford or make terrible decisions. In a free enterprise ike you have competition is good most of the time. 

As the kids say, " it's all good".


Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

BigHalfMile
November 18, 2019 at 01:09:35 PM
Joined: 04/27/2014
Posts: 62
Reply
Reply to:
Posted By: racer goin broke on November 17 2019 at 06:25:07 PM

It was $1.3 million dollar grant for the tunnel and new bathroom correct?

Another person said about a contractor for the tunnel job?  Is there a contractor for the tunnel job?   If there is; then the job should have been put out for public bid.    If it was put out for public bid then there is public record  what companies bid?  Does getting government money mean a job should be put up for bid? Maybe I will call my local politician and put his ass to work and give me the explanation on how grants work.  And if contractors need hired.  As a Pennsylvania taxpayer I like to know where every nickel of my hard earned money is going and how it is spent.

And if anyone knows about construction it will not even come close to costing 1.3 million if  the track and volunteers are doing the work.

Because  isn't the track is doing all the work?



The Juniata County Agriculture Society received a grant in 2019 for 1.3 million for the following projects.

1. Stormwater Management 

2. New pit and infield handicap accessible restrooms.

3. A handicap accessible Tunnel.

 

All projects were bid separately and were advertised to the public for bid by the engineer. The contracts mandates that the contractor must pay prevailing wages. The tunnel will be approximately 450 long. The widning  of the front stretch and stage removal is not part of the grant. The bids were made public at the bid opening. The track personnel and volunteers have nothing to do with any of the grant projects.



tenter
November 18, 2019 at 02:56:36 PM
Joined: 07/16/2008
Posts: 675
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Posted By: fiXXXer on November 17 2019 at 04:28:31 AM

Matching grants are far better than no grants. Lincoln and Williams Grove get none of the above. Don't get me wrong, regardless of where the money comes from, Port has done a phenomenal job elevating the place to its current status. A track can have millions of dollars to play with but if they don't have the vision and ambition to put it to good use, what good does it do? Husets is a prime example of that and for many years, Port was too because the place was a dumpster fire. All I'm saying is, you can't objectively compare Port to the other tracks as if they operate on a level playing field whenever the fact is, they don't. As I've said before, if Port wants to build a new foodstand, that money comes from the fairboard. If Lincoln wants to build a new foodstand, it comes straight from the owners pockets. And if Williams Grove decides to replace the tunnel, there's a zero percent chance that they will get grant money, matching or otherwise, to do it with. Kathy Hughes will be cutting a check from her own account. No one can deny that the game changes dramatically when you're spending someone else's money vs. your own. I appreciate what all of our tracks do to make Central PA what it is. None of them are perfect but they're all pretty awesome. They're rich with history and hopefully they'll still be here for us to enjoy for many years to come.



You're clearly clueless on how it works.




tenter
November 18, 2019 at 02:57:22 PM
Joined: 07/16/2008
Posts: 675
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Reply to:
Posted By: BigHalfMile on November 18 2019 at 01:09:35 PM

The Juniata County Agriculture Society received a grant in 2019 for 1.3 million for the following projects.

1. Stormwater Management 

2. New pit and infield handicap accessible restrooms.

3. A handicap accessible Tunnel.

 

All projects were bid separately and were advertised to the public for bid by the engineer. The contracts mandates that the contractor must pay prevailing wages. The tunnel will be approximately 450 long. The widning  of the front stretch and stage removal is not part of the grant. The bids were made public at the bid opening. The track personnel and volunteers have nothing to do with any of the grant projects.



Thank you for showing the facts.



Curt8c
November 18, 2019 at 04:25:46 PM
Joined: 03/18/2017
Posts: 15
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Posted By: tenter on November 18 2019 at 02:56:36 PM

You're clearly clueless on how it works.



+1



fiXXXer
November 18, 2019 at 08:41:34 PM
Joined: 10/26/2014
Posts: 2011
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Reply to:
Posted By: tenter on November 18 2019 at 02:56:36 PM

You're clearly clueless on how it works.



Whatever you say man. I have my thoughts regarding the subject, you have yours. If I'm clueless, I guess a lot of other people in the sport are too. I never claimed to know every nook and cranny of how it works, I just know that Port SOMETIMES, not most times, SOMETIMES gets grant money that none of the other tracks stand a chance of getting. I'm glad they do because they put it to good use and they always succeed in making things better. Doesn't really matter to be honest and it isn't worth arguing about it. Port Royal is a great place to watch a race and we're lucky to have it just like the rest of our tracks. 




revjimk
November 18, 2019 at 09:14:36 PM
Joined: 09/14/2010
Posts: 5073
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Reply to:
Posted By: Curious12 on November 17 2019 at 07:48:28 AM

Williamsgrove is nice but can do some improvements to be better. Crowd size is smaller each year and a shame

Go back to 730 start time. Many travel hours to get there and hours to get home. Shows run very late. They have quite a few 730 starts and drivers are there. Never saw that it made a difference to car count

No second division on big races or time trial races. Shows seem to run late enough.  Track is also big enough to run multiple cars for time trials. The most boring part of racing. 

Better food. Pizza is awful and cold on front stretch

AGREE Get cars out of infield for a better view fan experience

 



I don't think facility has much to do with dwindling attendance, its the racing

Plus loss of Hodnett & guys gone on to WoO

& yes, its a shame



longtimefan
November 19, 2019 at 05:13:20 AM
Joined: 12/02/2004
Posts: 267
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Reply to:
Posted By: tenter on November 18 2019 at 02:56:36 PM

You're clearly clueless on how it works.



+2. There is no shame in being clueless. Being clueless and constantly stateing things that just are not correct after being set straight every time this subject comes up?



fiXXXer
November 19, 2019 at 07:02:06 AM
Joined: 10/26/2014
Posts: 2011
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Reply to:
Posted By: longtimefan on November 19 2019 at 05:13:20 AM

+2. There is no shame in being clueless. Being clueless and constantly stateing things that just are not correct after being set straight every time this subject comes up?



So Port Royal doesn't operate via a fairboard and the other tracks don't function more like a traditional small business? You'll have to tell that to some people who actually work there because they got it wrong too. My intention was never to bash Port Royal. I've stated over and over how much I appreciate what they've done in recent years and I sincerely do. There aren't too many tracks out there who have turned things around like they have. My intention was to stick up for our other tracks that people are constantly talking shit about and they use Port as an example for comparison which is simply inaccurate. That's the only point I ever intended to make but as usual, the Port homers get triggered and make it something way more than it is. 




bgtexpress
November 19, 2019 at 07:24:43 AM
Joined: 10/19/2016
Posts: 437
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Reply to:
Posted By: fiXXXer on November 19 2019 at 07:02:06 AM

So Port Royal doesn't operate via a fairboard and the other tracks don't function more like a traditional small business? You'll have to tell that to some people who actually work there because they got it wrong too. My intention was never to bash Port Royal. I've stated over and over how much I appreciate what they've done in recent years and I sincerely do. There aren't too many tracks out there who have turned things around like they have. My intention was to stick up for our other tracks that people are constantly talking shit about and they use Port as an example for comparison which is simply inaccurate. That's the only point I ever intended to make but as usual, the Port homers get triggered and make it something way more than it is. 



+1....fiXXer I could not have said it any better myself. Like you, I am appreciative of all the work Port has done. However, deep down inside most of the Central Pa fans feel like you and I on this very subject. We should be gratful that The Port, Williams Grove, Lincoln, Selinsgrove and BAPS  have all reinvested back into their facilities over the years.



tenter
November 19, 2019 at 01:50:04 PM
Joined: 07/16/2008
Posts: 675
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Reply to:
Posted By: fiXXXer on November 19 2019 at 07:02:06 AM

So Port Royal doesn't operate via a fairboard and the other tracks don't function more like a traditional small business? You'll have to tell that to some people who actually work there because they got it wrong too. My intention was never to bash Port Royal. I've stated over and over how much I appreciate what they've done in recent years and I sincerely do. There aren't too many tracks out there who have turned things around like they have. My intention was to stick up for our other tracks that people are constantly talking shit about and they use Port as an example for comparison which is simply inaccurate. That's the only point I ever intended to make but as usual, the Port homers get triggered and make it something way more than it is. 



How doesn't Port operate like any other small business? You act like they operate with monopoly money.

PS> I know EVERYONE that works there.



fiXXXer
November 19, 2019 at 03:51:19 PM
Joined: 10/26/2014
Posts: 2011
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Reply to:
Posted By: bgtexpress on November 19 2019 at 07:24:43 AM

+1....fiXXer I could not have said it any better myself. Like you, I am appreciative of all the work Port has done. However, deep down inside most of the Central Pa fans feel like you and I on this very subject. We should be gratful that The Port, Williams Grove, Lincoln, Selinsgrove and BAPS  have all reinvested back into their facilities over the years.



Thank you. At least someone can see through the bullshit and get the point I was trying to make.




fiXXXer
November 19, 2019 at 04:22:04 PM
Joined: 10/26/2014
Posts: 2011
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This message was edited on November 19, 2019 at 04:25:13 PM by fiXXXer
Reply to:
Posted By: tenter on November 19 2019 at 01:50:04 PM

How doesn't Port operate like any other small business? You act like they operate with monopoly money.

PS> I know EVERYONE that works there.



Dude quit putting words in my mouth. I don't mean any disrespect to you or anyone else but I never insinuated anything of the sort. Yes it's a real business and yes they have busted their asses.....everyone involved to earn what they've made to this point and I don't want to discredit any of their hard work or success. Port Royal is one of the greatest turn around stories in the history of our sport. Take Lincoln for instance: Jerry Parrish, Mike Heffner & Scott Gobrecht own Lincoln Speedway. If Lincoln Speedway had an old outdated tunnel then needed replaced, they along with any sponsors who may want to help will foot that bill. Zero chance at any grant money. Port on the otherhand, got grant money because of the fact that they're a fairgrounds & they have access to those things. Grants are VERY hard to get. I know how the process works and those grants aren't just handed out like candy.....but at least they have a chance. Lincoln does not and neither does Williams Grove. I love all 3 tracks and I hate when people throw shit at the other 2 because they don't constantly have improvements going on. 10 years ago, the track most in need of improvements was Port Royal so they had much more to do than Lincoln and Williams Grove who instead kept up with things incrementally over the years instead of letting it rot like Port did. For instance they each already have a handicapped accessible tunnel and handicapped accessible restrooms and they each already have many of the upgrades in place that Port has done recently. Only one track has a paved pit area and a jumbotron but you don't see Lincoln people taunting Port Royal about it. They're all 3 awesome tracks and I wish more people would realize that instead of just blasting them with "but muh Port Royal" nonsense constantly. I truly believe that the folks at those tracks legitimately try their best to make things as good as they can be. I didn't think that about Williams Grove a few years back but they've really turned the corner and have been doing a lot better at trying to promote and get more marquee events on the schedule. Lincoln is in great hands now. You won't find more passionate and dedicated people than Heffner, Parrish and Gobrecht and I expect great things to continue happening from them in the future. Regardless of how funding is obtained by any of them, the fact is we have 3 of the best tracks in the country putting on great shows on a weekly basis and above all else, I'm most thankful for that.



amyjur
November 19, 2019 at 06:22:59 PM
Joined: 08/13/2005
Posts: 48
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This message was edited on November 19, 2019 at 06:30:32 PM by amyjur

Here we go again. This was discussed in a prior thread a month or so ago. I've had a question on this issue for some time and touched on it lightly in that prior thread. If any of you out there actually know chime in. The initial grant for the bleachers and this recent grant for stormwater management, the tunnel and new infield restroom were given by the Dept of Community and Economic Development not the Pa Dept of Agriculture. Look it up. The press releases from their local politician all speak to the economic impact that improving the facility will have for the area. Makes sense considering the government agency that awarded the money. It doesnt appear that these two grants have anything to do with agriculture and/or the fairgrounds. They look to be given to them as a business just like any other business. Correct or no? Or are they getting funding because of their nonprofit status? If you dont have to be a nonprofit  given the right circumstances what is to prevent any other track from applying for state money? No matter the answers it seems Port may have had people who knew or familiarized themselves with the system and worked with their local representative to make this funding happen. 





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