Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I believe the teams have permission to run this race, some teams choose not to, right before the nationals and some don't want to risk trashing equipment before the big race. I asked this question to a woo team and this is the answer I got.

i just remembered i was supposed to remember to 
remember something but cant remember what i was 
supposed to remember.

Also I would oike to add that ALL drivers; car owners crew members know before hand what their contract says and they knew that ONLY top teams get paided championship money and tow money and NO ONE twisted their arms to join the tour and lets see them find another tour that pays 10 grand every race except for 2-3 days shows and where to find some races that pay 150 grand; 50 grand; 30 grand; 25 grand to win races at gold cup; grove national open knoxville nationals; kings royal; so i would really NOT jump on Sides side too soon

Long Live  20 Time  World Of Outlaws Champion Steve 
Kinser #11 

I too would like to see Sides win and race when and where he wants . But I have to do what my emplorer says to do or I'll lose money or get fired also. I make sure to get verbal permission or something in writing before I take a day off or go on vaction.

i keep hearing people say they have to do what their employer wants them to do.

sides is not employed by WOO.

now sides did sign a contract to perform services. seems he kept up his part of the contract by participating in all WOO events.

as far as his participation in an event that he did not have permission to, it seems there was another team that participated in the event but violated the conditions of their permission to compete in it.

i am not picking favorites in this, but there are two things that come to mind.

WOO had an obligation to respond to sides request, and it seems they didn't. their lack of response could be interpreted as a lack of interest in what sides did. if they didn't want him to race, they should have told him. they didn't. no news is good news in my book. if sides asked if they would mind if he raced, and they didn't respond in the negative, even after further attempts, that sounds like a "do what you want" response to me. they have an obligation to respond, not to just ignore the request. now if sides at any time in his attempt to get WOO to respond to his request told them "if i do not hear back from you telling me i can't race i will take it as an ok on your part", he has a valid point in my book. that is what i would have done to try to get a response or an edge. better yet i would have sent an email telling the WOO that a lack of response would indicate a show of indifference. so unless i heard from them confirming their position i would take it as an ok to race.

now if another team was granted permission to compete in the same event, but under certain conditions and those conditions were not followed, then that team should have faced the same consequences as a team that didn't ask permission in the first place, but raced any way. in my opinion the team that was granted approval but didn't follow conditions is more at fault that a team not asking permission. it seems there was not equal enforcement of the rules for the team who didn't get permission and the team who did not follow the conditions of the permission they were given.

so even if sides can't show he was within his rights to run the race, it seems he may have a chance to show bias by the WOO in the enforcement of their rules.

to indy and beyond!!

I think we all want what is fair for Jason.

1. WRG seems to be inconsistent and selective with enforcing their "rules".

2. Does the punishment fit the crime? The $40,000 punishment seems excessive to me. I could see a punishment of a number of points (100-500 points) and maybe loss of tow money for a race or two. That in itself would be a tremendous punishment and send a strong message to every team.

3. I sent an e mail to WRG a couple of days after I heard about Jason's lawsuit and I got a response with 2 hours from Tom Deery if I remember correctly!! If WRG can respond to me, an unknown fan within 2 hours, why didn't or why couldn't they respond to Jason in a timely manor? Didn't they have his cell phone number?

4. All this publicity is a real negative for WRG is and will lose the PR battle with the fans. Look at this post, it's been going on for a month and has over 200 comments and there is no end in sight!

I SUPPORT JASON SIDES FROM DOWN UNDER

Not employed by the WoO? Seriously? Who did he sign the contract with then, Cheerios?

This whole thing is terrible for sprint car racing. Bring down WRG and the WoO would be a bad, bad thing.

Why can't you people just accept the fact that Jason made a mistake. Is it a bad deal, yeah. But a deal is a deal. He violated his contract. They let Donny run because his contracted had that in there, at the beginning of the year.

No news is good news....Seriously? You may disagree with how WRG handled it, but seriously, if the boss doesn't give permission, then don't do it.

I can't believe how so many people don't realize that contracts are BINDING. That means you have to do it or there will be consequences, probably legal consequences. Do you realize the mess our world would be in if we didn't honor contracts?

There was no favortism, the others just signed contracts at the beginning of year. Jason could have tried to do that do. He screwed up.

yes, jason is not employed by the WOO. you need to know the difference between an employee and an independent contractor.

jason is self employed. he did sign a contract to perform services. i think i said that.

no news is good news? well that is just my opinion. i never said it would stand up in court.

i also said if jason at any time told WOO that a lack of response by them would be interpreted as an ok by him, they had an obligation to make their wishes clear.

oh, one thing i have learned over the years it is usually easier to beg for forgiveness than to ask for permission!

as far as contracts go, they need to be honored by both parties. now if the WOO had an obligation to respond to sides and did not, who initially broke the terms of the contract? WOO seems to have had an obligation to give sides notice in time for him to make plans.

as far as the WOO being fair, it has been reported that there was a team who did not follow the conditions set forth in their permission to race the same event. they were told they could race, but only under certain conditions. it seems those conditions were disregarded and not followed.

so if the conditions were not followed, they didn't have permission to race.

so you say sides didn't have permission to race.

do you think both teams should be treated the same for not following directions?

as far as contracts being binding, as i said, it works both ways.

i guess we will all just have to wait and see what happens, so don't be so quick to hit the rev limiter.

getting all up on the chip really doesn't do any good.

to indy and beyond!!

not all contracts are legal and binding in the first place. you purchase a home with a realtor, you find a home, you write a contract with lets say a "contingency" that the seller does so and so. if they don't, you have the option to "opt" out of the contract legally.

whatever the reason WRG has an issue with jason and apparently wants to make a scapegoat out of him. we need to stand behind him imo and my opinion only.

who needs the WOO anyway? ever since WRG took control of the group it's all been downhill.

and martz, you need to get out more often. there is life after the woo! take a look as the ASCS series my friend, you may enjoy it. the fans don't get the benefit from all of the "top dollar" events that you proclaim is the top of the WOO heap. i for one could care less about the purse, i just love sprint car racing.........

Ascot was the greatest of all time..

West Capital wasn't half bad either..

Life is good...

great point...

Ascot was the greatest of all time..

West Capital wasn't half bad either..

Life is good...

Thats it exactly,one of the other teams were told by WRG that they could race that race,but cannot take that contracted car there & they could not take that trailer. I even heard a crew member from this team say that that was what they were told by WRG.

But they still went ahead & took that car & trailer to that race and competed.But considering who the car owner is,they just turned a blind eye to it. Just like the other team that missed one race but still got paid for car owner points!

How about the other year there that one certain team had been caught cheating by having undersized tubing in their chassis, they werent even penalised,just told to change that car,werent fined or had points taken from them or anything! Why didnt they cop a penalty like Sides copped,he didnt even cheat!!

Not privy to all the pertinent details ... but from what I've read on the message boards (so it MUST be TRUE! ) I think Kasey's team altered the car number as requested. But again... just from what I've heard/read ... I don't recall anything about them being told not to use the team rig... but I could be wrong...

Phil Taylor

home-theater-systems-advice.com

i don't think that other team that was found to have a piece of tubing that inadvertently got put in a car that was a little thinner than it was supposed to be was found to have it at a WOO event. i believe it was at the nationals and the nationals were not a WOO event at that time. so why would the WOO have any reason to do anything? as far as cheating goes, you really need to be careful throwing that term around. the tubing was not a performance or safety factor and was fixed.

by the way, that team has done pretty well lately.

to indy and beyond!!

Exactly right there L.O.G

i know exactly what happened.

and you are really picking at fleas trying to make a big deal out of something that knoxville didn't think was a big deal. are you saying knoxville was playing favorites? the car in question was found during their nationals, not a WOO sanctioned event. it wasn't like they had a stinking chemical treated tire or a motor that had to be pumped a bunch of times and then ok'd.

as for chassis flex being a performance advantage, i really don't think you want to try to tune a race car with one little piece of tube that you can not control or be sure it will act in a consistent manner.

to indy and beyond!!

The Kaseys team over nighted decals to Fargo to put on the Joey Saldana/KKR #9 car, a paper trail and witnesses can confirm this. The number was changed shorlty before the race at Fargo. Inside the pits sit the KKR rig that was told not to enter the pits. Once again pictures and witness, crew members can testify to this. Would you all like to see pictures? I'm very sure theres pictures of the car before and after and the rig in the pits! I'm sure when people are ordered by law to show up for court and testify in front of a jury, that most will be very very honest. I have heard from crew members the truth. If and when this makes it to court, I believe it will be proven that Sides and Sides Motorsports was singled out and treated unfairly in the stealing of his monies. I believe that it will be proven that WRG did indeed fail to do what they were supposed to do to make Sides contract valid. The contract wording can and will be proven to a jury that WRG had no rights in stealing the monies that they stole from Sides. The jury will hear how he was treated in Charlotte, how he was refused to park beside hes engine guy, how it effected his weekend of racing to be made to park so far away that the engine guy was unable to help him, how members of WRG employees disscussed doing these things to him before they parked him away from the team he normally parked beside. How he was denied a provissional that he earned and worked for throughout the racing year, How his sponsers were denied television exsposure on the last live tv exsposure of the year. How they kept him and his family and team in Charlotte an extra night and day knowing they weren't going to allow him a table at their banquet. How he was accused of vandalizing a trailer at the track, while he sat with his attorney, family, friends, drivers, team members, and even some of WRG employess in a hotel bar. Thank goodness for witnesses. I could be wrong also that I believe that justice will be served in this matter. I will as a fan and a friend continue supporting Sides and Sides Motorsports!

i just remembered i was supposed to remember to 
remember something but cant remember what i was 
supposed to remember.

One thing I dont understand. If Jason Sides is being singled out and effectively being run out of the WoO, Why? WRG is having enough trouble fielding a decend sized group of weekly racers so why would they single out a consistent, competitive racer, who makes every race and adds a bunch to their show? I dont geddit. There is no award for stupid, so they should quit trying to compete !

Larry