Forum: Minnesota Dirt Track Racing Forum (go)
Moderators: StanM

Yes, your ballpark figures are pretty darn good.

I still go 20 races between freshenings, but I've been pretty lucky. I know there is a new piston running around that is pretty damn thin and I'd say that's a freshen around 12 races but I could be wrong. I think cost will always be an issue and only get worse just like apprentice says. I don't have the answers, and I don't think anyone ever will! haha

Leo,

Let me first say you comments are very well thought out . However not all are actual and factual

1. ASCS did not raise the bar for 360 Payoff. Wissota had three levels of pay for the Promoter. Silver for 7000.00, Gold for 8000.00 and Platinum for 9000.00. The 9000.00 was payout at all the Brainerd and Cedar Lake shows, fact. ASCS is 9600.00 of which administration takes 1200.00 leaving a 8400.00 purse for the racers. Although most of the WISSOTA racers were the gold, 8000.00, there were some silver. maybe a guess would be 20%, 60% and 20%. Wissota dropped Sprint cars because of failure to book race dates because the purse was to high And car counts to low.

2. ASCS did however like you say brought a professional team to help run the show. Like you stated the teching was very good. ASCS has helped in this manner. However again 2006 had 8 or 10 shows in Minnesota around the Twin Cities. 2007 dropped to 5 and 2008 down to three. I regret my statement about "not doing anything for Minnesota" but the result of the number of shows is not disputable it is fact. Believe me when I say the bigger, better Purse was and is more appealing to the owner . However the race date are more important as this is JUST A HOBBIE! Many on the this board agree that it is not always about the money. which brings me to the number three.

3. The Kouba Memorial 2008 paid 2200.00 to win and 250. 00 to start. 14 cars came to support our efforts in the honoring of our Dad & Mom and we thank them for that. 14 though was a insult to their memory to say the least and we felt no one gave a damn about money or 30 cars would have been there. As you said we worked our butts off getting money for this race and 14 cars showed up. How would this make you feel Leo ? 17 years this has been the second highest paying race in Minnesota for the 360's which leads me to number four.

r 4. your statements about ASCS losing Brainerd to my influence are false. I informed Cliff Sasker and his new Promoter Tim that I thought it was in the best Interest of Sprint Car Racing to leave the Dates and ask them to do so. They both ask me what new cars and fans the ASCS would bring over the UMSS. My answer was I did not know, maybe 2 after last year what could not say. Economics force the decision which plays into an earlier post that given a choice they choose to go UMSS . I can assure you this did not make me happy but I do not walk in their shoes and am still happy to have the race date. I will agree that with out the UMSS they would have stayed but without the UMSS the other 15 races would not be either. It will still out pay more the a regular ASCS race. I have thousands of hours , for free, to help Sprint cars around here survive. I know we can't please everyone nor will we try.

The ASCS is a great organisation and if you think I am fat mouthing them you are wrong. If it was economically possible they should have and could have replaced the 30 Wissota shows we once had here. There is a reason Wissota failed with sprint cars. The same for the ASCS around here in the Twin Cities. This is and has been Stock car and Modified country for many years. They put on great races at an affordable price. Ron being a former owner of Cedar-lake Speedway understands if you are going after the same market[Tracks] you have to be completive. I know this will succeed and for the last 30 years and until I draw my last breath I will continue to help and will not apologise for that. If any of my post have offended any of you then I apologise as arguing and bashing on here serves no purpose. I need not Defend what the UMSS is going to do. The UMSS is a great thing for around the Twin Cities.

Joe, I just want to comment on the races in Brainerd and the possible low car count last year. You're right when you say 14 cars is almost a joke. I think part of the problem in Brainerd (this is my personal opinion and feeling from the 2 different times I've made the trip to race there), is the show has taken WAAAAY too long to run. Heck, the first time we raced there (ASCS Regional), we started at like 6:30 and we raced until like 1 in the morning! It seemed there were 3000 cars in the pit area and caution after caution after caution! It just gave me a bad impression of the place right away (not saying there's ANYTHING bad about it), and I didn't really have a great ambition to head back up there again (although at the pay window when I realized they were paying in cash, I jokingly looked at the woman and asked if I could get it in 1 dollar bills because that was the way I planned on spending it, the look on her face was PRICELESS!) I thought they had a decent car count that night, and then 2 years ago when they had the National series there, they had a decent count then too. I don't know what kept the cars away last summer, but I'm sure the price of diesel didn't help. It is a pretty long pull from southwest Minnesota, and of course you have several of the teams down here running for points too. It's unfortunate that more cars didn't make it to a show that paid that well.

Like I said before....keep on doing what you're doing!! Nobody can fault you one bit for doing your part to keep sprint car racing alive in Minnesota!

Hey Joe,,, In my own opinion,,, I believe that part of the problem with the low car count was fuel prices and the weekend that the race was held on,, the 4th of July weekend if I remember right,,, I know from previous attempts to promote races on that weekend, (MSS show in Cresco, IA, mortifieds in Owatonna) that is probably the hardest weekend to book a race on with all of the small town celebrations,,, You have one of the few exemptions to the rule in Kathy, but just try telling most wives that you are not going to go on a family outing and going to go to the race track instead and see how many nights you end up on the couch,, LOL

Brian

i have been reading this thread for a few days. Like others I would like to add my 2 cents.

Here is what the UMSS has done in my case. We are based out of Minneapolis and we were building a car this winter for the 2009 season. We researched all the local tracks and series. They were few and far between as far as 360 sprint car races. My only option was to race the IMCA Arlington deal. However, I did not want to build a specific motor package that I cant go and be competitive anywhere else (Knoxville, Jackson, etc) once I get to that point. Another point to this is resale. It is alot easier to buy and sell an ASCS 360 than it is to  buy and sell an IMCA motor with the $800 heads. At least in my case, maybe i wasnt looking in the right places? I was not satisfied with racing 2 ASCS races at Brainerd and we have ZERO travel budget.

So, we were moving, moving the racecar and team to South Dakota to race at tracks with ASCS rules. Jackson was a little too far to travel weekly.

Bottom line, the UMSS kept a Minnesota Sprint car on Minnesota tracks and I can go race wherever I want to in the country with the motor package I purchased by changing a $50 set of restrictors. The UMSS was a real lifesaver for me as I DREADED moving to Sioux Falls but would gladly do it to race sprint cars.

I am not saying anyone is right or wrong. I am also not claiming to have more facts or better facts than anyone. This is just the story of my race team. The UMSS kept one more sprint car in Minnesota and I will be competing at as many of their shows as my budget allows.

Good luck to everyone at every track and series.

Cody Hahn

Yes I also beleive the gas prices had an added effect last summer. That is one of the reasons I really started looking at Ron's idea of the UMSS and decided to help him. Again I was using the Kouba Memorial as a basis of some of my dicisions. My point again is that money dosen't alway work to attract cars and fans. I look forward to all the support that can be given not only to the UMSS but to ALL of the Sprint Car races around the country.

Joe

As someone who writes for a racing paper my first love has always been and always will be Sprints but I have covered a lot of weekly shows during the past ten seasons. My observation is that these stock car and modified classes are what keep these tracks going. They're getting three, four guys coming through the back gate with every car as well as family and friends in the stands. They're paying those guys anywere from $1,000 for a street stock purse up to around $5,000 for a modified purse at tracks like North Central and Princeton. Any Friday night at Princeton you'll see around 120-130 cars and their top class is modifieds so their overhead isn't anywhere near a sprint or late model track. Some with Brainerd, their top class is mods and they run, supers, mw mods, streets and pures along with them. You look at any of these tracks and they're not drawing huge crowds so those kinds of purses are attractive to the promoter because he's got to make a living.

Now you take the last few years based on what Joe said the sprints bring in14, 16, maybe 20 cars and they're paying the same pit fees. Their purse is a lot higher but with a low car count and many cars traveling further than the locals that run the stock cars every week the sprints aren't bringing a lot of friends and relatives. Take any driver traveling long distance for example and I don't think they're going to have the support of as many friends and relatives as the super stock driver from the gas station in downtown Brainerd. So you can see the economics, you've got a higher purse, not enough cars coming through the back gate to cover much of it and not even as many fans as the 30 pure stocks from around the neighborhood. (My reference to a specific driver in this example has been edited out. I was trying to make a point and didn't mean to single anyone out).

I think you can see the economics and why a series with a lower purse is necessary to get bookings at these tracks. Like Joe says, it's the competition they're up against. The way I see it, the UMSS or something like this had to come along to save sprint racing at these tracks. Build the fields, build the popularity, get a following like the modifieds have and then promoters will want them. Look at the Minnesota Modified Nationals at Alexandria, what is it, $7,000 or $10,000 to win? Something like that, more money than any sprint purse save for the world of outlaws, it's even more than the IRA or WDRL late models for that matter.

I agree, there should be a couple hundred sprints and every race should be $100,000 to win but right now the business model is broke, the ecomonomy is bad and the UMSS has to crawl before they can get up and run. I think for that reason, building this thing back up, that they're on the right track. If this don't work to revive more local sprint racing we might as well stick a fork in it.

Stan Meissner

You hit on what we have been saying all along. I think sometimes some people think all promoters are rich and this should work no matter what. The trend here, as you said, says it is not. for the most part the fans , racers and tracks are behind this effort and with there help it will work. We don't need nor will we get everyones approval. We have what we need for success. Now all we need is a history. What a great first year this is going to be. 18 UMSS races and 10 IRA races all with in 1 1/2 to 2 hr of the Twin Cities.

LeoLarson...... I think you need to re-check your so called "information" that Joe Kouba was personally involved with pulling 3 race dates at North Central Speedway away from ASCS.

The only people/persons involved with this choice was Cliff Sasker and myself.

To be perfectly honest, I have never even met Joe Kouba in person (that I know of). Although we have spoke on the phone.

We spoke with Chuck at ASCS and he agreed he would make the same choice as us if he were in our shoes. With fans finding other ways to entertain themselves, we thought the UMSS was the best choice for our track.

The ASCS is a first class group and we parted on very good terms. If the UMSS doesn't work out (for some odd reason), we would welcome ASCS back with open arms.

With the exception of Grosz, Lutz, Lund and one or two others, we will have pretty much the same teams racing at our track (we hope) as we had last year. Plus our purses for the Kouba Memorial and Mighty Axe races will be higher than the standard UMSS payout. So we may see a few of those teams anyway.

I may be new to this Promoter gig, but even a rookie can figure out that saving well over $12,000 for three events while still offering our fans a quality product will only add to my tracks' success.

I don't get on Stan's board very often, so I will throw this out for you (or anyone else) needing correct "information". .... My phone is always on should you have questions, comments, or concerns about any of the events we have at NCS.

Thank you for reading.

Tim Boeder

Promoter: North Central Speedway

[email protected] or 218-839-9280

well i guess everyonr that thought i was too harsh or out of my mind, or maybe just plain stupid read this mans post. nuff said!!!!!