Forum: SCRAFAN.COM Forum (go)
Moderators: ljennings

Looks a little sparse - not sure USAC is helping the sport (410 Non WIng) grow.   Instead of a strong unified 410 non wing series like in the real CRA or SCRA days, with have several diluted non wing series on the west coast with different engine rules.   Wished USAC would choose either 410 or 360 for the engine on the West Coast.   Kinda sucks to be a non wing sprint car team if you want to race often, you need to have both 360 and 410 equipment.

Ok so let's choose between going to the prom with the prom queen or let's just say not the prom queen. That is the difference between a 410 and 360. And yes I can tell the difference between the two when they are on the track. Please let us never lose the 410s and never make us choose. But yes I agree they need to figure out how to make it easier on the teams to run. But I am just a fan.

We need more sprint car racing at our home track.

lap times at perris really say otherwise , its more about who is driving them ....

Drama , Controversy , Rivalry 

when was the last time someone won a 410 race at Perris with a 360?oh btw the 360 times at the Oval Nats.were impressive,however if the friday and Sat. track was as good as thur.the 410s would have blown the track record away.and yes I can also tell the difference.

ROB

The problem is that not enough cars support the out of town races, for various reasons people wont go out of town, The arizona races will only get a handfull for the 410 races. hard to schedule races when the promotors will lose money. The whole dynamic of open wheel racing has changed over the years. lets hope it gets better but i dont see it in the near future.

Mark Priestley

Let us note a voice of reason (and first-hand observation) who has -- for a long, long time -- put his money on the line. 

That said, I remember when everyone was quite delighted with 270-cubic-inch four bangers and 283-cubic-inch eights. 

it makes no difference what engine , how big , or how much power it makes , what matters most is the quality of the competition . what  Mark said  was spot on , the big  problem with the USAC-CRA schedule is no one wants to believe only a few teams can afford to travel . if anyone out there wants this to change just figure how to get start money equilevant to how far the teams have to travel . if i had my way we would just go back to basics and focus on local racing  . its sad to me that we cant get a PAS sprint car class . the Pas has many classes , but has no sprintcar class . there are not many sprint car tracks that dont crown a sprint car track champion . many can argue and say young guns and seniors count , but they dont . those are trophy classes . 

Drama , Controversy , Rivalry 

Excellent points being made here. In most opinions, it’s about the money. Non-wing sprint cars at Perris is one of the greatest experiences either drivers or fans can have in racing. Focus on a show that attracts the highest quality drivers. If promoters pay enough to start and pay enough to win, they will draw an outstanding collection of drivers. Outstanding drivers and races will produce enough cars and fans to turn a profit. You have to schedule enough races to keep that collection. You can take it on the road but the economics have to be perfect and avoid long hauls in distance and time. The people to the north of us don’t need us, they are doing fine. The people to the east of us don’t need us, they are doing fine. They will never do what is best for us and I don’t know why they should. We should take back control of our own destiny and build the perfect beast in the richest market in America. 27-35 races in the Southern California market for a coveted championship. Digital presentation that can be marketed to race fans around the world. The foundation is there thanks to many hard working people and car owners who have survived against all odds. It’s all about the money. The economy is improving. We are in the midst of a technological revolution that allows marketing we haven’t even thought of yet. We have a school of champions unmatched. We have a group of young drivers coming up this year that are going to knock down walls. Focus on building The Show and it will race to the top. Just remember that nothing happens overnight. We need a leader that will focus on this only. We need professional sponsorship. We need to give teams reason to be dedicated to the vision. All of that and hard work will get it done. It’s not impossible; it actually seems the only sustainable path forward.

What exactly are you choosing?  If you want to buy a ticket or not?  Come on now...  Today's top, nationally competitive; ASCS 360 motors make more power than a good 410 motor did not that long ago.  If you don't like the non prom queen give her my number, I'll tap that and be happy about it.  The only thing, the ONLY thing, that is relevent in all of the 360 vs. 410 chatter is having both series makes it difficult for the best drivers to race eachother.  That is all that matters, and that is why 410 classes should be reserved for the national traveling series only.  Just call a spade a spade, if we all were 360 it would be game freaking on!  I want to see the best drivers in their regular cars racing all year.  Have we forgot the ARA vs. CRA days?  The best guys in CA run USAC/CRA which sucks for the USAC West Coast series.  They have great drivers but don't get the chance to race the best guys week in and out.  In Arizona we have some great drivers, but to race the best guys they have to run a car that is not their regular ride or try and get a 410 together.  Sucks for us. 

It bothers me when I read about fans "choosing" between 360 or 410 motors, it's not your choice.  A sprint car is a sprint car is a sprint car, and until you are ready to build you a car and come race me chill.  Be happy people are scraping together every dime they have to build a good car so folks can be entertained.  Your welcome.

USAC/CRA, West Coast, Western Classic, and Southwest.  If it was all 360 rules and CA was split north and south, southwest stays the same, katy bar the door.  Track championships, regional championships, western states championships...  you would know for sure who is the best.  Would be sick. 

410 motors, XXOO love ya but time to move on.

I have a question on what the added value that USAC brings to the table? How does USAC help the promoters? What are the comparisons between days of old when we had SCRA versus USAC now. Maybe its time to reach these goals set forth by the visions of Big Mike and others and head in another direction. I wish the URA would have succeeded. I'd like to see some comments from Car owners and drivers. I wish everyone a Happy Year in 2015 and look forward to the upcoming race season. Seeya at the track. SCS

I agree schduele sparce.    I travel and caught all races but the Arizona ones.  Santa Maria on Friday night doesn't fly.  Trying to get off work in time for 4 he drive and then turn around and head back to catch perris sucks.  Not not sure there is easy fix for the problem.  Sad to say king of west taking all the new fans and in doing so generaring money.  Non wing crowds were dismal at best this year.  I've never seen stands at perris so empty including oval nationals.  As far as 360 vs 410,  the 410 rule the day,  day after day.  It makes for better racing And you can dee difference.  If 360 were competive we would see more..  I've talked to several drivers and they all say 410 way.  With 360 you make a Mistake,  it gets bad,  410 you can throttle out.  Only places. 360 held with 410 was ventura,  Jake swanson qualified great in 360 at sat ovals,  but had nothing for them in heatraces.  I'm a fan of both and will continue to attend both.  I think more  cra events would help

we needed ura more than most care to admitt . the sad part is that it could have easly coexisted with usac . its unfortunate that some complete morons that only care about thier adjendas had it out for ura and stopped at nothing to kill it . with ura we were going to have victorville and orange show . the value of having these tracks so close to perris and the so-cal teams was huge . this made it possible to reinstate a larger so-cal following . right now perris relies on the locals to fill the seats that get sold . if we could somehow get victorville back and run ventura that would work for most teams that cant travel far. if we could just get vv back online it would be a huge step in the right direction . one thing that most dont want to address with 410 racing is that only 4 or 5 teams can afford solid engine programs . right now a new 410 can cost appox $ 50,000 if you have 3 teams that afford to buy new engines and everyone else working with scraps . it costs around $ 10,000 to freshen one of these modern 900 hp monsters every 6-8 races ,as a comparison the old reliable -12 engine that can make 800 hp can go 20 races between freshen-ups when maintained properly .  how are we going to bring new teams to the table ?. 

Drama , Controversy , Rivalry 

I'm not sure that you need two or three tracks in So Cal when you are having trouble filling one.

Perris as a home track and a few satellite tracks might be sufficient.

I'm not sure I agree that "only 4 or 5 teams can can afford solid engine programs".

Even if that's true, teams that want to race against the best will find a way.

Present a compelling show that justifies the expense of showing up and teams will come.

How much money would be saved if any if Perris Dumped USAC and copied a page out of Ventura. Perris Sprintcar Association? And if Money could be saved, could some of the savings increase the purse? I don't have anything against USAC but if I was the promoter I would have to look at my bottom line and ask myself what does USAC bring to the table?  USAC doesn't own any tracks so my interest is in the promoter and racers making money not a middle man. Maybe I'm off base here, maybe I'm not.  SCS

Mike its easy to see that when victorville was running on a regular basis and had a good surface it generated cars locally . this is what another track can do . as for the PAS , they have done everything in their power to try and increase fans in the stands for sprint car racing . the fact is that the PAS is just a little too far out from the masses to pull strong crowds . right now they rely on around 500-700 hardcore fans and the rest is locals from nearby surrounding citys . this is the same way it works for most local tracks in the midwest . when i say only 4 or 5 teams have a solid engine program that # is accurate . a solid engine program is when a team has the resources to replace an engine when needed , can afford new engines and has back-up engines equal to what they run as front line equiptment . the same engine program cost is why we see less USAC national teams running the complete series . i love your ideas , and once upon a time its what we had during the SCRA glory days . the problem is complicated and the answers wont come easy , just like in business , sometimes we have to get really creative with action solutions . as time moves on the same answer does not always work for the same problem . please dont think i write in any kind of opposition to what you do or say , we are fortunate to have someone like you that cares so much about what a few of us really love . 

Drama , Controversy , Rivalry 

"Present a compelling show that justifies the expense of showing up and teams will come" and start thinking outside the box for fans. Racing has become a old and stale sport that has not changed in 50 years why is it neccessary to have a 3 to 5 hr program to run 25 cars? Watching the televised races on MavTv I couldn't help but notice that few tracks had good attendance the question is why, and I think in this fast paced world of communication that we live in dead air will not work. Very few sporting events last more than three hours and very few movies last more than three hours, whats the answer I have no clue but I hope some one will come up with a program that will keep this sport alive.

Grady

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Grady your # is way off , its over 70 when you count all of cars , cra , young guns , seniors , and lightnings . but you are right about the time frame . i have said this before and i will say it again , i have seen more cars raced in less time at watsonville , they work the most efficient program i have ever seen , and its consistant . they rarely get done after 9:30 pm. 

Drama , Controversy , Rivalry 

When it comes to a well run program look no further than the Chili Bowl, when the racing starts its non stop action with little interuption, and look at the program it keeps getting bigger every year.

Grady

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@ first glace it would seem getting everyone to row in the same direction would be easy , I think history has shown it is the most difficult thing to accomplish !

The above Comments are satire & for entertainment
purposes only

Since USAC came to California and SCRA got kicked to the curb, the number of races and the number of cars has decreased dramatically. Purses are stagnant. Crowds at most races are mediocre. Some traditional events have faded away. It's not all USAC's fault. These are problems nearly everywhere. But USAC has demonstrated that it has no solutions. USAC is all about business as usual, which ain't working. 

I would love to see an individual or group with real funding, credibility and creative ideas come forward to challenge USAC in California and Arizona.