Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Well   as  stated  elsewhere  on this board  , car  counts  are  dropping in most  all  divisions  in various   forms  of racing  , not just  410  sprints cars  . Yes  , the economy  is not good  which is  why  attendance  is dropping  at  some races , the costs   to attend  races   is high , fuel  prices   to fans  and race  teams  are  high , general overall costs  are  hurting  everyone .
  So  we  all  know  how  to lower  costs for  teams , but  the sanctioning  groups  are  not  taking immediate  steps  to do .

It   is  all  forms  of motorsports that  is suffering  , so  now  is  the time to act  not later .

sanctioning bodies are just as bad as almost all corporations. Greed,look at the Allstars. 

 I   respect   your opinion  , so   why  don't   you  respect   mine  , instead   of  saying   my  thoughts  or  opinion

  is  nonsense  .  Thanks   for  your  opinion  ,   I care   alot   about the   status   of racing    don't   you  ? that   is why  I

  express  my thoughts   . Most  of what   I say   have   merit   not  BS , as  some may state on here  but  I respect 

   everyone   on this  message   board .

I'm in favor of any cost cutting moves that will bring car counts back up.  However, remember the double edged sword in doing this.  Nascar made cost cutting moves with the COT and not allowing any changes to suspension, etc.  Tied the crew chief's hands and made the racing much more boring.  SO, with that being said, it is likely going to represent the IROC series more and more in every form of racing if they drop costing through regulations.
I dont have another solution though.

"winning drive" your efforts go noted but these sprint car guys are numb to what your saying as long as they can go to a 15 car field on some mud puddle track locally. They wont agree with you until theres NO cars then theyll cry like scalded ass apes and want costs cut.  Its the problem of keeping up with the Outlaws, the be loved Outlaws that all these yahoo's lose sleep over to see.  Stewart and Kahne teams have corporation monies and deep pockets to feed there teams on the Outlaw tour and the tour trys to keep up and the country follows the Outlaws.  So,...... you have your twelve touring Outlaws enjoy them and watch the rest of country lose its assosciations keeping up.  I guess theres always 305's to save the day!  god help us.

CAJ

Not sure where you go to see racing that only has 15 car fields but maybe you should try coming to Central Pa and see some full 410 field sprint car racing, lol.

So please tell us how you would cut costs. Making teams change something usualy cost them money not save it. Most rule changes to lower cost will make what they already have illegal and force them to spend money to replace it with the new legal less expensive parts.

I think it's actually pretty simple.  Higher purses.  We are still paying out the same amounts we did back in the 80s 90s, cost of minimum wage needs to be raised.  Want a car count pay more money so these guys can afford to run and afford to travel. 

Inflation of parts, cars and motors should mean increase purses.  But that doesnt really seem to be the case.

Costs me $

I think it's actually pretty simple.  Higher purses.  We are still paying out the same amounts we did back in the 80s 90s, cost of minimum wage needs to be raised.  Want a car count pay more money so these guys can afford to run and afford to travel. 

Inflation of parts, cars and motors should mean increase purses.  But that doesnt really seem to be the case.

I just saw that the All Stars are raising the "tow money".  Currently it is at $100, that is what it was in 1994-1997 when gas was around a buck or so.

Simple? Where does that money come from? The crowds are down, the cost to track owners and promoters is also rising. Fual prices, equipment, insurance, lighting, staff........  The list goes on, but all that stuff cost a lot more than it did 10 or 15 years ago also. 

The problem is, when someone thinks they get a great idea to save the racers money, they get a few freinds, and create a new class of cars, thus dividing up the small car counts even more. How many different classes of sprints do we have now? Back 15 to 20 years ago, we basically had 2 classes. Not long before that, we had 1. Now, we have so many different classes, and sets of rules, we can not count. 410's, and ASCS 360's are still pretty much the norm, but you also have many different versions of 305's, and more and more spec motor classes popping up everywhere. It does not matter what class you are talking about, the car cost is the same. The only difference is the motor. But where does that save any money? The top 305 teams in Ohio are out-spending most of the 360 teams. The top 360 teams are out-spending most of the 410 teams. Hell, even the top mini sprint teams are out-spending a lot of 360 teams. 

Another class to save money is not the answer. You can have a rule book the size of Texas, and you still can not control how much money someone will spend. Make them run narrow tires, and they will spend the money to work around that. Tire soaking, and traction control are huge in the stock car classes on pavement. Starting to see it on the dirt. Spec motors you say? Look how that is working in the late model world. You can buy the parts you need to cheat them (gaskets) on e-bay. The money is still being spent, and the average racer will feel he has to spend it to try and keep up. 

Racing is expensive, for everyone. It sucks, as there is no end in sight. Some new classes will thrive, like IMCA modifieds. But even they are struggling most everywhere. Car counts are no where near where they were. We use to dread waiting for 6 heats of mods, and 2 last chance races. Now, maybe 3 heats and an A-main. 

A track can not take a chance on a new class of cars either. Most operate week to week as it is. Change to a new class of cars, and they run a huge risk of losing cars, and fan base, which most tracks can not afford. Sorry, but a cost saving 305 class does nothing but lower the purse even more for the teams, and they simply do not draw the crowds the 410's do. 

It is a lot like the tire rules. If there was an easy solution, that actually saved racers some money, someone would have thought of it by now. Instead, we have a bunch of keyboard warriors (myself included) who think they know better, but refuse to step forward in the real world. 

Higher purses dosent work,  just ask Dirt Cup.  25 Grand to win and they had 28 car half of which was junk.  

CAJ

I think high purses can help, it just needs to be spread out. The Trophy Cup did it last year. Originally, it was going to be 50K to the winner, but they dropped it to 30K and spread out the extra 20K through the field. Send everyone home with a sandwhich instead of one guy taking the whole loaf of bread.

what is your problem?  I had no problem reading his statement.  

The 305 specs (even though a V8 is more than anyone really needs) should be the elite class in the sport.  That would take care of the car count trouble.  Nothing but chevs permited, any driver with any type of vehicle operation experience immediately competitve, track records wouldn't need to be listed on web sites saving even more time and money, a well-managed household with 3 or more monthly welfare checks could become a part time WoO car owner, quantity not quality is what any passionate and knowledgable fan wants anyways

Luna's Ford engine style that won 2 WoO titles and 3 
Kings Royals before a weight rule against the best EVER
in their prime and now DOMINATES super dirt late model
racing is no longer allowed/wanted in a WoO sprint
car.... Was Luna a miracle worker?