Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Does anyone have an idea where Schatz compares to Kinser in victories at this stage of Schatz's career? In terms of age I didn't know if Schatz was ahead or behind Kinser in victories.

I'me not for sure but since Kinser was in his prime at Schats's age and winning over 30 features a year I would say Schatz is way behind. Schatz is around the 160 mark and Kinser around 577 so I would say your question is answered. They count every feature now including prelims and they didn't when Kinser was winning everything. Kinser may have close to 1000 WoO wins, who knows. Schatz will never match Kinser's wins or championships. Schatz will never replace Kinser BUT he is one very damn good sprint car driver and the BEST right now, his record shows that.

Well said....

In the late 90's to early 2000's, Schatz was getting lapped, as Steve, Sammy and Mark were all very hard to beat. Schatz has payed his dues and is definetly the guy, has been since around 2006, when the NST formed and Schatz won his first WoO championship. Schatz is definetly top 5 all-time im my book.

The older I get, the faster I used to be.

He's ahead of him in Knoxville Nationals at this point, Kinser had 7 by the time he was 37 (1991), Schatz has 8. My guess is by 1991, Kinser probably had around 250 WoO wins, and as mentioned above, that didn't include prelims.

Kinser was winning races right out of the box, it took Donny years to get to that piont. Ricky Warner saved Donny Schatz!! Not taking anything away from Donny, he is the best right now hands down.

Most would say Kinser's best years were when he had Karl.  He certainly still won a ton after Karl left, averaging right at 20 wins a year from 95 to 05 before starting to fall off.

Just don't think it's fair to say Ricky saved Donny.

I recently counted Steve Kinser's wins from Eckert's website.

Schatz is now 37, Steve was 37 at the end of the '91 season.  At the end of 1991, Kinser had 303 WOO A feature wins. (Steve Kinser's 500 win poster says he had 305 A wins at the end of the '91 season.)  He had another additional 75 preliminary wins at this time.

As of now, Kinser has 577 A wins and another 143 preliminary wins. That makes 720 Woo wins.  I counted 907 total wins including his early days in Indiana and his winters in Australia and various other series. I think that total number is a bit light because I don't know exactly how many wins he had in Australia.

Schatz is around 165 at the moment plus a handful of preliminary wins I'm sure. Kinser easily has him doubled up at this point. Also,  Kinser started racing in '76 so he was 22. Schatz had raced with the WOO as early as  '96 at the age of either 18 or 19.

Ricky and Donny make a goog pair, Donny didn't have any Knoxville nationals wins before Ricky although he had a number of seconds and he didn't have any WOO championships before Ricky. And Ricky had no Nationals wins and no WOO titles until he got with Donny. Although he won the Gumout series title with Tyler Walker. Rick and Donny are good together.

This is some good research. This puts the thread to rest. Thanks.

Im a big Schatz fan but Kinser is in a league of his own by far. What Donny doing right now is incredible though and the whole TSR STP team deserves alot of credit for what they are doing. I must say though I believe there is quiet a bit more competition currently compared to when Kinser was winning. Not taking anything away from Steve because he still had to run all the races and wasnt just given the wins. Both drivers are extremely talented and surrounded by equally talented crews.

And although we are comparing both at 37 yrs old, this is Donny's 19th year with the Outlaws. When Steve was 37, he was only in his 14th year with the Outlaws.  His 303 wins in 14 yrs is an avg of over 20 a year NOT including preliminaries.  Donny 's 165 wins is an avg of  around 9 per yr not counting prelims. And i realize there is a lot of good competitive racers today, but where Steve had Sammy and Doug and even guys like Doty, Blaney, Mark Kinser, Davis Jr. etc,  Donny has racers equal to the latter 4, but he hasn't ever had to run with the caliber of Sammy and Wolfie on a nightly basis.  PERIOD.

Locals are much more competitive now and the fields are much closer in speeds than they were then. Let's not pretend it was harder to win then than it is today.

You are very right,and I've heard Steve himself say many times that the competition is much tougher today than in the past.Years ago the Outlaws rolled into town with their all aluminum proffesionally built engines and ran against the locals cast iron wet sumped engines,the locals never had much of a chance.Kind of like taking aknife to a gun fight.

In raw numbers yes, but that was 30+ years ago. Can't compare eras, it just isn't fair to either party. It's kinda like comparing any athlete from any sport from 30 years ago to those in their prime today. Just not a fair comparision.  Enjoy em while they are here. 

Let's also remember who was Steve's competition when he was in his prime. Steve had to contend with Sammy (+300 wins) and Wolfie (probalby 150-200 WOO wins)!

Schatz major competetion has been Jason Meyers, Joey Saldana, Craig Dollansky and Darryn Pittman. All good drivers but not in the same class as Sammy and Wofie.

A mans greatness is measured against how great his competitors are/were.

Who cares, Schatz is a fucking idiot.

+1

The numbers are what they are.  I was at GHR last night, Kinser won the dash and led the first 10 laps. The crowd was loving it! Then Schatz got by him and you could sense everyone`s collective sigh! In the mid eighties it was "Anyone but Kinser" now it`s "Anyone but Schatz" That should be a testament to how good he has become. I`m headed to Willamette for tonight`s race and I hope it`s "Anyone but Schatz"