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Topic: I'd rather see Saldana win a championship
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March 01, 2012 at
04:00:48 PM
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This message was edited on
March 01, 2012 at
04:01:24 PM by BigRightRear
and Tmac's performance in FLorida proves your point...huh?
http://www.woosprint.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=category&layout=blog&id=106&Itemid=78
you might be the only guy in history to drive across the country 3 times a year for a decade to watch a Kinser beat the living crap out of the traveling also rans hundreds of times over...at what point did you figure out WHO was going to win each night?
Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better
weather." Van May
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March 01, 2012 at
09:03:29 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: BigRightRear on February 29 2012 at 05:48:06 PM
Does that make Kville the home of the no track wonders?
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Kville.....Kville??? Did you SLEEP through the Knoxville Nationals last August??? I don't get into the whole WoO/Posse pissing contests like I did when I first got on here, but you just made yourself look silly. The Nationals ISN'T just Kville vs. WoO like the Grove is- still with me?-because that's fairly important! 2011 Knoxville Nationals Wednesday qualifying night A-Main 2nd place: Davey Heskin. Thursday qualifying night A-Main Winner: Mark Dobmeier, 3rd place: Brian Brown. Saturday night A-Main was started by 6 current WEEKLY Knoxville drivers (Dobmeier, Brown, Terry McCarl, Don Droud Jr., Heskin, and Austin McCarl). Plus 2 former locals (Craig Dollansky and Kerry Madsen). That's 1/3 of the entire starting field of 24 cars. Yeah, this year the car count was only 99, but let's stop pretending that the Knoxville locals are still nobody to fear.
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March 01, 2012 at
09:46:07 PM
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This message was edited on
March 01, 2012 at
09:52:51 PM by singlefile
Reply to:
Posted By: Slamm1n on March 01 2012 at 09:03:29 PM
Kville.....Kville??? Did you SLEEP through the Knoxville Nationals last August??? I don't get into the whole WoO/Posse pissing contests like I did when I first got on here, but you just made yourself look silly. The Nationals ISN'T just Kville vs. WoO like the Grove is- still with me?-because that's fairly important! 2011 Knoxville Nationals Wednesday qualifying night A-Main 2nd place: Davey Heskin. Thursday qualifying night A-Main Winner: Mark Dobmeier, 3rd place: Brian Brown. Saturday night A-Main was started by 6 current WEEKLY Knoxville drivers (Dobmeier, Brown, Terry McCarl, Don Droud Jr., Heskin, and Austin McCarl). Plus 2 former locals (Craig Dollansky and Kerry Madsen). That's 1/3 of the entire starting field of 24 cars. Yeah, this year the car count was only 99, but let's stop pretending that the Knoxville locals are still nobody to fear.
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All that is well and good. How many Knoxville regulars have actually beaten the Outlaws there? These arguments are always funny for their lack of consistency. When Rahmer travels 18 hours from home and wins two Nationals preliminary nights, it is dismissed because it was a "split field." When Mark Dobmeier does the same thing against a split field at his weekly track, it is built up as some of "proof" of the awesomeness of the Knoxville regulars.
A guy that hasn't raced regularly at Knoxville in over 10 years is still used to bolster the amunt of "Knoxville guys" in a given field? And PA fans get grief on here for using guys that actually race the majority of the time in Pennsylvania? LOL
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March 02, 2012 at
12:49:43 AM
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Reply to:
Posted By: singlefile on March 01 2012 at 09:46:07 PM
All that is well and good. How many Knoxville regulars have actually beaten the Outlaws there? These arguments are always funny for their lack of consistency. When Rahmer travels 18 hours from home and wins two Nationals preliminary nights, it is dismissed because it was a "split field." When Mark Dobmeier does the same thing against a split field at his weekly track, it is built up as some of "proof" of the awesomeness of the Knoxville regulars.
A guy that hasn't raced regularly at Knoxville in over 10 years is still used to bolster the amunt of "Knoxville guys" in a given field? And PA fans get grief on here for using guys that actually race the majority of the time in Pennsylvania? LOL
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Yeah, lol that's the funny thing. The fact that PA fans aren't allowed to "claim" drivers that they watch every week like Pittman, Hodnett, etc. yet others are boasting about drivers from 10 years ago. It's all fun and games though.
On topic kinda, it was a real surprise to see AO do so well in Florida. I think most people consider him in the Tier II portion of the Posse and they usually don't even fair well against the Outlaws on hometurf let alone elsewhere. Breakout year?
More on topic, barring another injury Joey will be in a dogfight for the points title down to the final race in Charlotte.
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March 02, 2012 at
01:26:38 AM
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Reply to:
And how many posse drivers took one car, one motor and funded the trip out of there own pocket? Give the guy a break
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March 02, 2012 at
01:32:57 AM
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Reply to:
Posted By: singlefile on March 01 2012 at 09:46:07 PM
All that is well and good. How many Knoxville regulars have actually beaten the Outlaws there? These arguments are always funny for their lack of consistency. When Rahmer travels 18 hours from home and wins two Nationals preliminary nights, it is dismissed because it was a "split field." When Mark Dobmeier does the same thing against a split field at his weekly track, it is built up as some of "proof" of the awesomeness of the Knoxville regulars.
A guy that hasn't raced regularly at Knoxville in over 10 years is still used to bolster the amunt of "Knoxville guys" in a given field? And PA fans get grief on here for using guys that actually race the majority of the time in Pennsylvania? LOL
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So, you're telling me that YOUR belief is that because SOME WoO fans think that Rahmer's qualifying night wins weren't that impressive, that Knoxville regulars Nationals accomplishments are a non-factor. I never said a word about Freddy, I watched him win and even cheered him on. You can take both Dollansky and Madsen out of the equation if it hurts your feelings that much, that's still 6 regulars in the Saturday night A-Main out of 99 cars.If that is a bad ratio-1/4 of the championship field, then I can't help you. I was only responding to the moron that implied Knoxville regulars weren't up to snuff, and if you agree with him then this discussion is pointless anyway.
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March 02, 2012 at
05:02:53 AM
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Reply to:
Posted By: MSPN on March 01 2012 at 03:20:40 PM
From what Florida just showed again there are ZERO Posse cars that can beat the Outlaws but anyone with a brain already knew this and has for years. Still waiting for you or someone to get around the 'one track wonder' deal and a decade later nobody has. Steve Kinser has won more W of O races at the Grove than ALL the Posse drivers combined (when you don't count Bobby Allen who wasn't a Posse driver for the most part when he won his races there). Heck, Sammy, Schatz, and Mark Kinser have won twice as many races there than either of your two best, Kreitz and Dewease. And to think this is the ONLY track you've been competitive at with the Outlaws over the years. Talk about myth-busting or over-rated or reality-check, no matter how you look at it the Outlaws can't beat the Grove but have no trouble with the Posse, history has shown this and statistics have proven it, I sure miss the good ol' days, lol.....
PS Having to use the stats from the Grove site which hasn't been updated since '09 it says, yikes!!!
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Pittman just won Georgia. Dewease and Stevie Smith in the Zemco car have won Lernerville. Dewease and Hodnett have won Charlotte. The Posse has more Knoxville wins than the Knoxville regulars. Where is it exactly that the Posse doesn't run good at? They have twice as many good cars as the Outlaws and they race twice as much. You can't beat simple math.
They don't even know how to spell sprint car
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com
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March 02, 2012 at
07:18:30 AM
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Hey cubic, Ive never gotten involved in this pissing match before and I don't really want to now, but I would like you to explain your comment that "the posse has more Knoxville wins than the Knoxville regulars." Am I missing something here? I don't know that one tracks drivers are better than another. It isnt really comparing apples to apples. Maybe we can talk a promoter somewhere in between Pa and Ia to have an invitation race and invite the top 15 in points from Kville and the Grove to a neutral site. Im not sure how it would turn out but it would be damn fun to watch. Anyway, I would love some clarification on your comment there Cubic. Thx.
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March 02, 2012 at
08:14:07 AM
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if Kville racers had a fuel card they would be racing PA already this year...and come back when the corn is harvested....no need for a special invitation right?
Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better
weather." Van May
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March 02, 2012 at
08:18:12 AM
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This message was edited on
March 02, 2012 at
11:33:10 AM by Mephit71
Reply to:
Posted By: Dirthawk on March 02 2012 at 12:49:43 AM
Yeah, lol that's the funny thing. The fact that PA fans aren't allowed to "claim" drivers that they watch every week like Pittman, Hodnett, etc. yet others are boasting about drivers from 10 years ago. It's all fun and games though.
On topic kinda, it was a real surprise to see AO do so well in Florida. I think most people consider him in the Tier II portion of the Posse and they usually don't even fair well against the Outlaws on hometurf let alone elsewhere. Breakout year?
More on topic, barring another injury Joey will be in a dogfight for the points title down to the final race in Charlotte.
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There's also the mind-bending absurdity of this argument.
"PA Guys suck because they don't go on the road and win" being the main argument MSPN uses.
But the ones that have gone on the road, if they DO win, it doesn't count, because since they're on the road, they're no longer PA guys, especially if they've moved (ie : Stevie Smith).
If Lucas ever manages to win a race (not including the one he had in Australia), it's going to be "He's an Outlaw, he's not one of yours!"
The other part of the argument being that guys like Hodnett and Henderson can't count (starting from the time they started driving regularly in PA) no matter how long they stay here.
But my point is this: If the only drivers who count as "PA Guys" are ones who'll never leave PA for various reasons, it seems stupid for anyone to try to throw "they never win on the road!" into PA fans' faces.
On top of that, I think I'm just offended at the idea of being lumped in (by other fans) with a guy who is specifically out to piss people off (which is what C$ is).
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March 02, 2012 at
08:46:40 AM
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There is NO debate here and never has been one. Just some hurt feelings when the actual facts are exposed. The Posse has a history of winning about 25% of their races at the Grove vs. the Outlaws and losing 95% of their races at most other tracks including the PA ones. Many, many years ago they were termed 'one track wonders' and this gets a few cheerleaders upset. This whole argument was started in the early 90's when I spent some time at a booth in PA during a winter trade show and discovered how passionate (blind) the locals were about their drivers. Some research and I came up with some stats that surprised me and I started a me vs. them bit going in a chat room (TJ Slideways) before this place even started. One of the people I used to talk about this info was a plumber from Central PA named Allen Holland who was and is a great guy who never really cared much about this stuff, he was obviously just a sprint car fan. He hasn't changed his stance either other than being more pissed with me in here because of the stuff that has happened over the last decade or more. However, I said then and will say now, I never took it to the personal level until first personally attacked. It was all fun until things got stupid and then stupid people got involved and it escalated. I still enjoy bringing up the stats because 'numbers don't lie' and they are shockingly in great favor with the Outlaws, way more than one could imagine. On occasion it gets fun again and I do miss going to PA to continue the debate because they are some of, if not the best racefans in the country and there is no better place in the country to watch an Outlaw show than Williams Grove, America's Slowest half mile (that runs sprints, that is, lol).......
PS Any suggestion that somebody from the Knoxville area should be running Central PA right now shows an absolute lack of brains, IQ or whatever you want to call it. Heck, the big dogs and 99% of the Posse regulars can't even get to Lernerville for an Outlaw show most nights and it's 3 hours away, please stop making yourself look foolish, you're a much brighter, errr, lighter brighter than that....
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March 02, 2012 at
09:19:56 AM
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This message was edited on
March 02, 2012 at
09:23:26 AM by BigRightRear
and what is Knoxville's home field advantage percentage?
Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better
weather." Van May
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March 02, 2012 at
09:47:04 AM
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As previously mentioned, Knoxville regulars like Lasoski and McCarl have gone all over the country to beat the Outlaws unlike the Posse one track wonders. How much does it have to snow before you catch the drift, there is no home track advantage for them which is how they have managed to leave the porch and win elsewhere, hello???? The last thing that comes to mind with these two guys is one track wonders as they have both won in more than a dozen different States in their special careers....
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March 02, 2012 at
11:47:51 AM
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This message was edited on
March 02, 2012 at
11:48:54 AM by BigRightRear
in other words, the "locals" home field advantage at Kville is nowhere near 25%?
the real reason they leave is the inability to make a living as a driver in the midwest - same reason you went to Canada!
Hawker has the actual win / loss data and posted it here for severals for your annual groundhog day emergence...
Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better
weather." Van May
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March 02, 2012 at
12:21:22 PM
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You were the first person I told (a year and a half before, granted) I was moving back to Canada, how ironic you try to make up a different reason, come on Mark, lol. Some of the former regular Knoxville guys have won there over the years like Wolfie, Dollansky, Tatnell, Hererra and Danny and Terry but they have nowhere near the record the Grove regulars have because it's not the tricky track the Grove is. Any local that runs there can beat most Outlaws on any given night but not make the A against them on most other nights, it's what happens at the Grove and is why the Grove gets most of my credit not the flukester that beat them. Still would be great to fly down there in the red rocket to see the Lincoln show, just might if things go right.....
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March 02, 2012 at
02:18:33 PM
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Reply to:
Posted By: Oppermanfan on March 02 2012 at 07:18:30 AM
Hey cubic, Ive never gotten involved in this pissing match before and I don't really want to now, but I would like you to explain your comment that "the posse has more Knoxville wins than the Knoxville regulars." Am I missing something here? I don't know that one tracks drivers are better than another. It isnt really comparing apples to apples. Maybe we can talk a promoter somewhere in between Pa and Ia to have an invitation race and invite the top 15 in points from Kville and the Grove to a neutral site. Im not sure how it would turn out but it would be damn fun to watch. Anyway, I would love some clarification on your comment there Cubic. Thx.
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Head to head, when the Posse rolls into town, the Knoxville local contingent eats our roost...
They don't even know how to spell sprint car
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com
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March 02, 2012 at
02:52:14 PM
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I thought the Midwest Ford Dealers stopped sponsoring the nationals a while back? Cubes, you wouldn't be referring to a preliminary race from 2006 would you? Surely the Posse have had more recent success, maybe winning a few Nationals with their superior driving ability and equipment? Haha
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March 02, 2012 at
10:04:57 PM
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Steel City Posse just won in 2010.
They don't even know how to spell sprint car
much less chromoly...http://www.ycmco.com
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March 03, 2012 at
08:56:15 AM
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Dont you mean "Steel City Outlaw?" Also, I spent a night in Harrisburg in December. Does that make me Posse?
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March 03, 2012 at
09:12:15 AM
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Reply to:
Posted By: MissouriSprintFan on March 03 2012 at 08:56:15 AM
Dont you mean "Steel City Outlaw?" Also, I spent a night in Harrisburg in December. Does that make me Posse?
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Absolutely...the question is why didn't you stay here considering how perfect central PA is in every way?
Luna's Ford engine style that won 2 WoO titles and 3
Kings Royals before a weight rule against the best EVER
in their prime and now DOMINATES super dirt late model
racing is no longer allowed/wanted in a WoO sprint
car.... Was Luna a miracle worker?
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