Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

     Unless you sign up with the WoO and pay a sanctioning fee, or have an existing big race to fall back on, putting on a succesful big sprint car show looks to be darned near impossible. The thread about the Mansfield race points out some of the difficulties. In the past, Husets Speedway tried to start a big race tradition that failed. Badlands tried to make something out of nothing and ended up with not much more than a higher paying weekly race. 

     As a fan, I have to question some of how these races are put together; specifically, hoping to get big name drivers without paying the price, and putting the big money on top.

     I think we can all agree that you won’t have any WoO name brand drivers at a non WoO race. Whether you like it or not, the WoO has figured out how to leverage their brand. If the race paid $100,000 to win, but only if your car number was 15 and your first name started with a D, Donny Schatz still would not be there without a WoO sanction. Both Donny and the WoO know which side their bread is buttered on.

     I say that putting the bulk of the payout in the winner’s check is actually counterproductive. A track champion in our area said it cost him $1,000 a night to be on the track, if he didn’t break anything. That was 20 years ago, his shop was 10 miles from the track and gas was probably under a buck a gallon. Just to do that today is probably in the $2,000 to $2,500 range perhaps. Then add traveling costs.

    In the Mansfield race, for example, it looks like you’d have to finish in the top 7 or 8 and not crash or tear up anything in order to break even. If you’re not a top of the line, big money team, what’s your incentive to come to this race? Talk all you want about staying on the porch, but doesn’t sticking closer to home make more sense? I know-Knoxville is probably the most notable exception, but it does pay better.

     If you took the Mansfield purse and split the $100,000 winner's share over the field you could probably pay $25,000 to win, $5,000 to start and $500 to run the B and C main. Would that get more cars and better racing than a top heavy purse with a thinner field?

 

In general WoO member can NOT race non-sanction events.

you say theat mansfiled is Top Heavy and hurting car count, but the last time I looked they have over 60 cars signed up and we are still in March.

This.

Also keep in mind there are two nights with checks both nights. And there is a non-qualifiers race which pays as well.

There's going to be plenty of cars at Mansfield and plenty of heavy hitters. 

Zearfoss, Dietrich, Smith, DeWease, Rico, Haudenschild, Blaney, Macedo, Eliason, Brown, Madsen, etc. 

     To be fair, I'm not saying it's a threat that Mansfield is Top heavy and hurting car counts. I'm asking if Top heavy purses attract better than purses where the same total payout money is spread out a bit.

     To be clear, I'm not picking on Mansfield. Never been there, don't know a thing about it or this race other than what I read here. That was just an example that is current.

     What other tracks without a long tradition of having a big race have had success without a WoO sanction?

oh... I thought you were talking about upcoming NCAA Final Four...

I agree with RPaulson & Pennsboro.... 60 teams think its worthwhile, including some tough cookies

If you look at it from a practical, dollars & cents approach.... NOBODY would be racing sprint cars

So   ssshhhhh.... you never know who's listening

Last years Tuscarora 50 wasn't WOO sanctioned and paid 50G to win. 66 cars, lots of heavy hitters and by far the largest crowd in Port Royal history. 

A

Yea, I got there early, so I thought... line was already out to the road. Great show

Lance & the 69 team have a REALLY good winning percentage at these big $$$ shows

Just sayin'.....

I agree about more even purses, but its not my call....

I'm a broken record on that subject. I've maintained for a long time that a top heavy purse is a great "sell"......but not a great racer friendly attraction. I think that is beginning to sink in some in those areas of the country that are hurting for car count. 

I will say this, every team that is not at Mansfield will be watching to see who comes out on top. Knoxville, keeps drawing 100 cars every year, and it's WoO sanctioned. What's the odds on somebody beating the top outlaw teams there ? Ya it's the nationals and some say it's all about winning that race. So if the purse was cut in half would they still come ?

If this mansfield race is a 1 shot deal, then heck ya load it top heavy, if they plan to bring it back i would believe they would be better off spreading the money thru-out the field. 35,000 to win and 1500 to start, just my thoughts.

Look at what Earl did, the big E has had some big purses over the years, what do cars keep coming back for. The World 100 has to be there biggest race of the year, they all want to win that one. After that i would say the 4 crown nationals and then the 50k sprint show.  

WoO, hog ties there teams. Somebody go ask Bobby A. if this is really outlaw racing. Make sure you print his reply. 

I think it comes down to personal preference and the guy signing the cheque [Canadian note of money] gets to decide. Extremes are no one would come for winner takes all and no one would come for $500 for all. Big money gets attention and most drivers are men who only see the first place payout until they finish anywhere but 1st. I think they will be happy with the car count and attendance. Good luck to them. $100 000 will go a long way in anyone pocket. I also like the idea of WoO cant attend. I think alot more nonelite teams will try. Realistically why would a local tacer try Knoxcille? Not for the money. Just to say they did it. Without the WoO these guys can at least have a chance of big money. Hats off to the promoter for ensuring someone without a million dollar budget will get the prize.

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

Knoxville draws that number even without the WoO sanction. And did for many years. So Knoxville isn't a good comparison, and the word sanction is a pretty loose term when it comes to the WoO and the Nationals. Regardless of who says what. As for Eldora, I think Tony made the changes to the purse structure that he did to help maintain a car count that had been slipping a little. And he still maintains his format for the Kings Royal. And I agree......the WoO are so far from being Outlaws it isn't even funny! And that could be topic for another thread.

A lot depends on the track and where it's located. I think most tracks in OH and PA can pull off a high paying non-WOO race no problem. Other areas that don't have as strong a local 410 scene need the big name sanction and names the WOO brings. Personally, if the WOO disappeared it wouldn't affect my life much. I don't dislike them. They have good drivers good racing but I think they've hurt the sport more than they've helped it the past few decades. I enjoy an all-star or even a local show just as much as a WOO show. Hell I even like 360's and <gasp> late models.

A

Mansfield is already paying $2,000 to start. I don't think the purse is THAT unbalanced. $100k puts fans in the stands, 2nd-$20k and 3rd-$10k is respectable for plenty of teams to show up. My original prediction was 75 entries and its looking like they'll hit that number with ease.

DeWease in an interview on Sprintcarunlimited said he thought it would be better for the racers if they paid 25k to win and spread the rest through out the field. Then went out and won the 50k.

Friday – April 27th

*** Prelim Night - Field split in half and compete for two different main events. Top 4 in each main event are locked into the SCWC Saturday night ***

TOTAL POSTED PURSE ($44,000)

MAIN EVENT #1 - (30 Laps) 1st – $5,000 / 2nd – $3,000 / 3rd – $2,000 / 4th – $1,500 / 5th – $1000 / 6th – $900 / 7th – $800 / 8th – $700 / 9th – $600 / 10th thru 20th – $500 to Start

MAIN EVENT #2 - (30 Laps) 1st – $5,000 / 2nd – $3,000 / 3rd – $2,000 / 4th – $1,500 / 5th – $1000 / 6th – $900 / 7th – $800 / 8th – $700 / 9th – $600 / 10th thru 20th – $500 to Start

Saturday – April 28th

TOTAL POSTED PURSE ($200,500)

SCWC MAIN EVENT - (TBD - Laps) 1st – $100,000 / 2nd – $20,000 / 3rd – $10,000 / 4th – $9,000 / 5th – $8,000 / 6th – $7,000 / 7th – $6,000 / 8th – $5,000 / 9th – $4,000 / 10th – $3,000 / 11th - $2,900 / 12th - $2,800 / 13th - $2,700 / 14th - $2,600 / 15th - $2,500 / 16th - $2,400 / 17th - $2,300 / 18th - $2,200 / 19th - $2,100 / 20th thru 22nd - $2,000 to Start

***3 Great Lakes Dirt Nationals provisionals will be tagged at the tail of the field if they are needed. Thus making the possible starting field 25 cars***

NON QUALIFIER RACE - TOTAL POSTED PURSE ($10,400)
(20 - Laps) 1st – $2,000 / 2nd – $1,000 / 3rd – $900 / 4th – $800 / 5th – $700 / 6th – $600 / 7th – $500 / 8th – $400 / 9th – $375 / 10th – $350 / 11th - $325 / 12th - $300 / 13th - $275 / 14th - $250 / 15th - $225 / 16th thru 22nd - $200 to Start