Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Excluding the obvious, swapping out the engine, what alterations must be made to a spring car to convert from a 360 competitive piece to a 410?  Or is it possible for a traveling team to convert incorporating the same chassis ?

In short the only major difference is the motor. Some 360 cars run with a dished wing which isn't legal with a 410, but many 360 teams do run the flattop 410 wing when running their 360 motors, IE a 410 wing is legal with a 360 minus whicker bill heights which usually can be easily swapped.  

Additionally 360 cars don't need as big of a fuel cell as a 410 cars would need at the nationals. Again many teams that run both just stick with the bigger fuel cell.

Also depends on how the car was put together.  If a car is was put together with smaller hoses and such for the fuel system the entire fuel system would have to be changed on the car.  

So in short there are some definite things but I imagine it is easier to take a 410 and throw a 360 in vs the other way around. 

Change motor, fuel pump, top wings (360 guys can still run dish) and tires to meet sanctioning requirements as different compounds for 360 series and 410 series. That's it

So can a 410 woo car put in a 358 engine and make it a true 360 car then change the motor to a e05 and be a true 305 car then take the wing off and be a wingless sprint? I guess what i am asking is... Are all 4 of these divisions basically the same frame chassis wuth just diffent engines and bolt in accessiries and tires?

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

Yes, chassis are all the same and bolt on parts are all the same

Easy answer is Yes.   Real answer is no, there are subtle differences.  BTW, a 358 is not the same engine as a 360.  Horsepower order, 410-360-358-305.

Frames are very, very close, but not identical as frame dimensions are optimized for the different engine HP and weight.  Engine setback, wheelbase, cage height, engine tilt, torsion bar heights, torsion bar split, W-link angle options, are a few things that can be custom ordered or different between manufacturers with engine size considered when choosing.  But majority of parts interchange.

We swap our Maxim wing cars between 360 and 410 with no other changes.  However our nonwing has different bidcages, front axle, Pitman arm, front torsion arms, and a few other minor changes, but in our case the same basic chassis dimensions as the wing cars. 

They appear to be the same when bare.

There all the same until you go to the pay out window. Then you'll see the difference.

THANKS to everyone who responded.

Wouldn't weight be an issue on some of the 410s with all the light weight parts or the other way around where some of the 360s would have to cut weight to be competitive?  I would imagine a 360 driver might need a bigger right shoe and a little more room in the crotch of their driver's suit as well.  

Stan Meissner

You got that right!   Unfortunately the check for engine rebuilds is written twice as often on the 410, the tire bill, ring and pinions, driveshafts, u joints, etc......but it's worth every penny when the green flag drops!  Go Shaver.

Perhaps on things like brakes and stuff like that.  Not 100% up on the 360 rules and what they allow/don't allow as far as titanium/alumimum/magnesium goes.  

Please let us know what the difference is in the 358 and 360. I thought it was 2 names for the same engine. Actually 35i in size to fit into a 360 ci max rule.

What are the horsepowers of the 3 sprint engines and are they all basically all small block chev configurations other than aluminum racing castings?

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

410 - roughly 850 - 900 HP (most close to 900, but depends on engine maker, config, $$$, etc.)

360 - roughly 700ish HP

358 - close to 700 HP (might be off on this a bit), but must use steel blocks and heads

All, as you know, are purpose built engines. But they're based off chevy small block.  There are some Ford 360s out there too (here comes minthess) but Chevy small block is the go to and right now while a Ford 410 is being devleoped by TSR & Ford it is not approved for use with the WoO.  360s are big obviously with ASCS, but also in the Midwest and right now probably rule CA and also in NY and Canada.  It always boggles my mind why 358s have stuck around central PA, but it seems to be the only area that uses a 358 and has not moved to 360.