Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Remember when.

WoO drivers and team owners are saying enough is enough. 100 races a year is to much, away from home base for to long.

USA sprint car series. Come one, come all. We have Steve Kinser in the house. The 11 team wanted more money in there pockets because they felt they were the show. Ted Johnson waved bye. 

ASCOC,  owned by Tony Stewart,  runs basically ohio, pa, indiana, with a few races in bordering states. The have a niche in that locals feel they have a better chance of winning. Home more than a WoO team, and cost are less. A WoO team could put a few extra dollars in there pocket. 

Winner, NOBODY

Loser,  the guys on the road that run under the banner of being an outlaw. There are NO true outlaws anymore. 

This   ^    

Run what you brung and race where ever you want was the true Outlaw way. Ted offered an option to capitolize on their talent. Now its a business and the WRG make the rules. We have seen it in the past how hard it was to start a new series in football basketbal car racing now golf it seems the NFL.NBA.WOO,PGA all seem to be able to withstand any mutiny. Kyle Larson is probably one of WOO  biggest draws and He isnt a card carrying member. Cappy stood his ground and is one of the few!

LOL, minding P's and Q's.  I don't miss the phone calls and e-mails and trying to calm down irate drivers, owners, promoters and sponsors.  It might have looked cool to have a site but trust me, it wasn't worth the headaches looking back at it.

I think what Sprint fans who don't watch Late Models are missing abou this is that it isn't an attempt to go head to head with the WoO, it's the Sprint version of Flo's Race Night in America.  Basically another racing option during the week to catch some eyeballs on an otherwise dead night.  Late Models easily out number Sprint 2-1 and have more that one traveling series.  

We remember the two attempts to break away from the WoO in '89 and 2007.  That was head to head with the biggest names hailing from the WoO tour.  At the end of the day the thing that made the difference was the WoO brand name was to Sprint Cars what the name Klenex was to tissue paper.  For every fan sitting on groups like this agonizing about the possibilities there are ten others who don't pay any attention to these forums.  Certain ones that call themselves racing media, like a certain crooked mouth shit stirrer that has shown up on YouTube, are trying to create controversy over another nothing burger.

I watched one High Limit race so far, good week day show with a car count in the thirties.  My only involvement is to decide whether to watch the 9/27 race or catch up on one of the streaming series.  I already spend too much time watching races on the weekends so I sometimes skip a few so I can tend to other aspects of life.  Streaming keeps me connected to racing in my 70's after chasing is for years.  It gives me ideas for road trips and something to sneak a peek at on my phone when out and about.  It's unlikely there will ever be one of these mid week races anywhere near me as there aren't enough 410's to fill the field.  The deal in this post is that people are agonizing over what amounts to a Tuesday night TV option for all but a few close enough to squeeze in a live race on a work night.

Stan Meissner

That's right Stan, I'll watching on Tues night. They will be gunning for 30 grand and it might be an Ohio local, or an invader who takes it home. I don't see what there is to complain about. 

I thinks it's great if you are having races with a good car count and the fans are happy. The best thing is it's not going to be 1 of 4 or 5 same drivers that's always holding the trophy and taking the check home at the end of the day. Don't get me wrong, I love watching the Outlaws but as long as WoO has them by the short hairs they're screwed!

I'd add Gio Scelzi, Rico, Hampton and Brown.

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Greg Hodnett was quoted as saying once, when you run a true Outlaw schedule, you really have to win alot to make money, which Marks and Macri have done. But with the Outlaws, you can make money even if you don't win alot. Case in point, Gio Scelzi. 

According the great Bill V, GIo has raced 69 times and won $168k. He's got no tow/bonus or point fund money coming. He's had an okay year, won 5 times and ran alot of WoO races, but he'll be well behind many similar WoO teams in total winnings. 

Another example James McFadden, ran 61 times, and won $184k. No wins, but at 7th in points is scheduled to get $60k in point money. Spencer Bayston, another example, 61 races, won $162k. 2 wins but has struggled the 2nd half. Still on track to win $57,500 in points. Not to mention the bonus money they get for each race. 

The WoO point money is nothing to sneeze at and why there won't be some mass exodus from the series. It is a million dollar point fund. Along with the full-timer bonus money of 500 to 1000 for each race for the top 12 full time drivers. All the top teams will make 30-40k just in bonus money this year. So the top drivers might not be happy about some things being a platinum member requires, im sure they like the point fund and bonus money.

Exactly, that tow money, especially when they ran 2 cars out of one rig, is what kept Shark Racing on the road and get established. That and Bobby is a racing on a shoestring certified genius. 

It is said that part of being on the platinum deal gets teams 1500 a race. To old to remember but Shark racing usually did not travel to the west coast. I'm sure somebody can verify that, but once drydene came on board and woo up'd the dollars for being a full time member they've made the trip over the Rockies since then. 3 yrs now ? 

I watch the slm guys that run woo and Lucas and it's common place for a lot of those guys to pick and choose. They go were the dollars are. 

Shark racing has made the west coast trip every year since joining the tour.

Bingo. Easily the most concerning thing out of all of it. Fans, drivers, and owners always complain about needing higher purses which to some extent is fine. It's when it becomes unreasonable to go to the races due to costs that it goes off the rails for me. Family  of five makes it hard to justify 200 bucks to see a race once you add up all the other things associated with a short day trip without a hotel stay. 

Everything is expensive, racing, movies, sporting events etc when you bring 5 people. I highly doubt a family of 5 is all going to special shows unless they have a relative racing in it. This might be hard to hear, but they aren't setting ticket prices for a family of 5 when it comes to big races

As of 9/19/22, according to Sprint Car Rating (.com) Brent Marks has won $592,321 this season.  He is the highest money maker over Donny Shatz at $383,965, David Gravel $337,565, and Sheldon H $336,325.

That's a lot of money, but considering an engine goes for around $60,000 (and you need a few of them over the course of a year) I'm guessing (not a big guess either) nobody is making any money.  Every little bit helps no doubt, but this sport is very very expensive (crashes aren't cheap either).  Given the current environment of inflationary pressures on our day to day lives I wonder how long the sport can keep up as we know it, given the rising costs to the teams and fans.

I can just hear one of the owners "We won $400 grand this year but spent $800 grand doing it."

I understand completely all of that but it's possible to prove your self out of a fan base and my word of caution is be careful. I feel like dirt racing has resurged on a national level in the top tiers of racing while NASCAR cant quite get back to what they were no matter how hard they try. Big shows are great and I go to my share cause I can afford it but dont think for a second that this die hard won't cut back or rethinks his decision when the price seems steep. As I said be careful. 

Took the words from my mouth...

Stan, e-mail me and I will give you some good news about watching a certain series for free!

[email protected]

Yep the last sentence says it all. The WOO point fund and appearance fees are nice but I'm sure they spend a fortune in travel and lodging expenses. A true outlaw or an all-star driver can hit ALL of the top paying races in the country, many of which are not outlaw shows. Marks has made a nice amount with a fraction of the travel. Of course nearly half of that was from 2 nights at Eldora. IMO drivers and teams from PA, OH, mid-west don't really need to be on the WOO tour to do well. Making your own pick and choose schedule makes more sense when you live in a region that offers a lot of good paying races.

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