Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

Spoken like a true man who doesn't have to worry about bathrooms.    Hate to break it to you, but it is a very big deal to women.   It has nothing to do with how big of a racing fan they are.   If a woman has a digestive disorder, like my wife and one of my daughters do, then it becomes an even bigger deal.

bingo!

if our mission is to keep this a grey haired male only sport by pissing in the parking lot...can we still claim to "support the sport we love"?

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

Most tracks barely have enough cash to keep the doors open, let alone make the crappers arena-quality. I would agree that if Knoxville has some inkling to do an upgrade, it wouldn't hurt to look at the bathrooms, but they are an exception in the dirt track world. 

two words for you: Port Royal

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

Fair point but Port also got a 800k grant from the state to build the main grandstand and is located in a very auto racing friendly area. By all accounts, Port was completely underperforming due to incompetent management. Once they got people who knew what they were doing, and showed commitment, they took off.

Most tracks dont have the advantages Port did. 

and you get grants bey having your shit together to meet the criteria...run into it several times a month in the business I serve...fact is, race facilities start falling down LONG AFTER the management gets accustomed to letting it happen...no different than a baseball field with weeds in the infield.

the built in crowd is walking away from the sport...and it is not because of "social media" as some may claim...it begins with a deaf ear to good business practice and laziness.

Lincoln 1845 ft/.35 mile T1=118MPH 
Eldora 2287 ft/.43mile T3=135MPH
Port 2716 ft/.51 mile T3=TBD
Grove 2792 ft/.53 mile T3=135MPH
Selinsgrove 2847 ft/.54 mile T1=136MPH
"I didn't move to PA from El Paso in search of better 
weather." Van May

For one, with regard to Knoxville I think the men's bathrooms are probably adequate.    Obviously I wouldn't know about the women's but I think you could go a long way towards improving them without going "arena quality".     

I agree, the men's restrooms are adequate, but if racing in general is to survive the women't restrooms (at all tracks) need to be upgraded significantly.

IMO, the women't restrooms should be at or above arena quality and here's why:

Females make 75% of the decisions when it comes to spending money on entertainment.  Like it or not, the restrooms do have a huge effect on those decisions.

In central Iowa during the summer you have the following entertainment options to choose from nearly every weekend:  Iowa Cubs (Triple-A Baseball), Arena Football, Concerts (Arenas, theaters and 5-7000 people all purpose facilities), racing (at many local tracks including Knoxville), movie theaters and a multitude of other one-off events such as the Principal Charity Classic (Senior PGA Tour), The Solheim Cup (similar to Ryder Cup but for LPGA - had over 125,000 attendees over 3 days last weekend), not to mention the entertainment district in downtown DesMoines.

Out of all those I just listed, racetracks are probably currently the cheapest to attend overall (I-Cubs and Arena football tickets are about the same price or lower, however their concessions are much higher than racetracks), but they also are dirtier, more out of the way for a majority of the population and can last until wee hours of the night on occasion.

To compete for those entertainment $'s, they need to ensure that they are at a minimum of "on par" with the competition when it comes to facilities and amenities.

Like it or not racetracks are competing with those entities for $$$.  The die-hard fans are already attending, racetracks need to attract new people to the races in order to survive and thrive.   Seems that most "fans" are content with the status quo and seem to blind to the fact that the average age in the grandstands at racetracks gets older by the minute.

I'm sure Super Chuck spends plenty of time worrying about bathrooms.... thats what makes him "Super"!

As a business owner too, dirty, poorly maintained tracks are running off patronage, therefore money, by not improving the facilities.  They can't afford NOT to improve the facilities starting with the bathrooms.   The most common comment I get with two girls in the house when it comes to racing at a certain track is either, "at least they have nice bathrooms" or, "I'm not going there, their bathrooms are disgusting!"

A similar example is restaurants, even fast food.   We all learn the places to stop on our major freeways for a food and bathroom stop with the family.   I like Carl's Jr, and the one in our town has a spotless eating area, but with absolutely horrible bathrooms that smell and look terrible always.  I haven't eaten there in years.  I have stopped by a couple times and the bathrooms were still bad, so a large Dr Pepper and off to In-N-Out.  There are tracks I won't mention to a friend who has never been to a race, even if we are running there, if the place is a dump.  I don't like new fans knowing we accept filth as staus quo.

Getting away from the bathroom debate that developed, I really enjoyed your write up.  Thank you.

"The future of everything seldom requires throw back creature comforts..."

Absolutley classic comment. I think the discussion of female comfort is a key that I have never considered before. Any sport anywhere should consider that to attract more females and thus more males. Lets face it boys like hanging out where girls do and girls don't where there is doo. No spelling mistakes except for absolutley??? ,aybe.

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

Super Chuck can say with 100% confidence that when he asks Mama Chuck if she wants to head to Lake Ozark Speedway for the 360 show next weekend, she would NEVER respond with, "But what if the bathrooms are pooey?".  She'd be like, "Hell yeah, I'm in.  Let's load up the whole Chuckin' family after football practice and point it South."

Super Chuck gets it, bathrooms are a big deal for chicks.  Heck, Mama Chuck REFUSES to use a porta-potty unless it's the absolute only option.  But some of you guys are acting like Knoxville has holes in the ground to squat over.  Are they the Taj Mahal of bathrooms?  Absolutely not, but the place is far from a dump.  Super Chuck doesn't spend a whole lot of time in the ladies shitter since "the incident" but Mama Chuck rarely comments about Knoxville's potties so they can't be that bad.

Anyone staying home just BECAUSE of the Knoxville bathrooms would also say "these cars are too noisey and I got yucky dirt in my hair".  You shouldn't cater to that crowd because you won't keep them.  There are thousands of women in the stands every week that show it's not the widespread issue it's being painted as.

Knoxville is light years away from most tracks, yet some of our vocal locals just have to find something to bitch about.  It really gets old.  Super Chuck went out East to catch some PA action and really wish more people would get off the Knoxville porch so they realize just how good they have it.

Super Chuck

LIke I've stated before.  This has nothing to do with the die-hard fans.  it's about attracting new fans to the sport.  Outdated and dirty bathrooms turn people away, plain and simple.

Tracks have one chance to make a good first impression on a new fan and like it or not, bathrooms are part of that first impression.   Most think the on-track action is breath-taking (even if we die-hards think the race was a follow-the leader parade).  

Take a look around you in the stands, the fanbase is gettting older by the minute.  It's obvious that most tracks have lost a couple generations by just looking at faces in teh grandstands.

If Taj Mahal bathrooms is what it takes to attract new faces to the grandstands, then EVERY track should be doing so.  That's how they'll create the next generation of die-hard fans. 

Those fans that you think stay away because of the bathrooms have no issue with the noise or dirt (or they wouldn't go things like Supercross or Monster Truck shows at Arenas).  They continue to patronize those events year after year (and those events are seeing INCREASES in fans that attend.

Die Hards have to stop comparing dirt track facilities to each other, and realize that tracks are competing for $$$ and they are competing for the $$$ currently being spent on entertainment at arenas, stadiums and the like.

Man, you sure know a lot of stuff.  You really should reach out to the Fair Board and offer your services.  They might could use a guy like you.

Super Chuck

Agree with this and I'll take it a step further.  Sponsors take great note of track facilities and appearances.  I want my brand to be associated with a professionally run facility that does simple things like make sure the front gate area and the entrances are well mantained.  Do you know how easy it is to pick up trash?  How inexpensive (in the long run) it is to buy annual flowers and plant some near gates?  How easy it to to cut the grass?  Yeah these things don't matter to die hards, but I pay attention everytime I go to the track that we're a major sponsor of.  We're partnering our brand with our track because we believe it targets a passionate audience.  I damn sure want them to put their best foot forward.  No one may notice the cut grass, flowers planted, clean signs, etc. but you better believe people will notice if there was trash everywhere, weeds as high as the corn and poorly lit signage, etc.  That's before we even get into the facility and start talking about bathrooms, etc. 

First thing I notice when I drvie up to a new business I have not been before (whether its an insurance agent, a restaurant, a doctor's office) is the outside appearance.  My father has owned a mechanic business for over 30 years.  He sweeps in front of his garage, makes sure everything is painted nicely, picks weeds, shovels in winter, cleans constantly.  Does most of these things before he ever opens the door.  

As to bathrooms, I don't know what Fairbury IL paid for theirs (& I've only been in the mens room), but they built a new block building bathroom facility in the last couple years.  Very nice, plenty big & well maintained.  I'd think given the type of construction that it would not be a huge undertaking for a track that has some $ to upgrade.  One thing with Knoxville would be where do they put additional or new bathrooms.  The grandstand area is a bit "locked in".  Could build a building in the back, but then you are having to get a pass out to go to use the facility.  

The Fairboard knows they need to do this (at least the members under age 50 do as well as a couple of the others).  While they have upgraded the restrooms in recent years, they know they still have a lot of work to do in this area.

I don't think bringing up things that they could improve on is bitching. Actually vande is one of  the posters on here that makes some really good comments.

Example is Friday I am sitting at my camper at Red Rock just looking around. One thing I noticed is all the campers around me were huge RV's with older (Mid 70's) people. In fact my whole loop was older people there for the races so that is a glimpse of the fan base. 

Knoxville didn't get to where its at today by sitting back and not doing improvements. Thats why it has the status it has today. Going by the Super Chuck mentality we would still be sitting in a 20 row main grandstand looking at a quanset hut on the backchute.