Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

I subscribed for the WoO sprint fast pass subscription and I got a charge nov. 20th for another month. They will not refund the charge because my subscripton they say lasts all year long. The WoO sprint season ended  weeks before the latest charge. They told me late models had a live race yesterday I could watch. All season long my script was for sprints only now its good for late models? WTF? DISGRUNTLED DEDICATED FAN.. And yes I cancelled the same day i got charged but still no refund.

C'mon DirtVision, this is how you want to do business. The fact that they took our annual subscriptions (that were once suspended during the WoO off-season) and automatically made those 12-month agreements seemed a lil sneaky. I cancelled mine the day after the World Finals. The fact is DirtVision has the ability to refund you for that month and if they cared about taking care of each and every customer you would think they would make that happen for you.  

I cancelled after World Finals too, no problem

At least thats what their e-mail said.... lets see about next month's credit card bill

Still refusing to refund the charges. Wonder how many others got blind sided with this. I had the exact situation with Flo tv and they refunded with no arguement.. Hmmmmmmmm.

I must also add I did file a dispute with this issue with my credit card company and they are investigating.

Certain organizations have perfected the ability to hide behind technology. 

I'm still miffed about a hockey website that airs our local hockey team. I live in Canada and put in my postal code to pay $39. When the charge came thru it was in USD so about $55 for me. They said they do not have the ability to credit a customer. They even tried to tell me my computer was registered in the US, so my IP address was the problem. Guess what? I have never watched another Hockeytv broadcast in the last 3 years.

LISTEN Dirtvision, LISTEN.

Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

They did sent out an email annoucing the fast passes would be billed for nov-jan and you would have access to watch australia races.

Information was sent out via email to all users that Fast Passes were year-round subscriptions. There is also plenty of information on their website, as well as on social media if you use any of those, that say all the Australian events (which are Sprintcars, Late Models, Midgets, Modifieds, and more) that are included in both Fast Passes. The Fast Passes also give you access to watch the Australian events in the Vault on the same day as the live event so that the time difference doesn't cause issue for anyone. Their policy has also always stated that they require a 2-business day notice for cancellations. 

You're not telling the OP anything new here. This seems like a great example of the written word coming off as poorly as possible. Do you have any empathy for the OP?

DirTVision established a precedent over a long period of time. This is a change. They put in the minimal effort to cover their backsides. It feels like they are much more concerned over keeping their one month payoff compared to keeping a long term customer. It just looks bad. 

Me? I stopped my subscription before the finals as I didn't want to pay a months fee knowing I would only be able to watch one night (cheaper to pay for one night as opposed to an entire month). I'll crank it back up again when we get to Volusia, but I'm fairly certain that if it were me that felt like I got screwed they would lose a customer for life. There are tons of other series worth watching every Friday and Saturday night like The Lucas Oil ASCS 360s and the All Stars.  

Went throught the same thing, Dirtvision was devious about it. When purchasing the Saturday night of the Knoxville Nationals, they very discreetly had a small box to check, if you wanted to opt out of a "free" trial that would continue charging you after 30 days. Very easy to miss, and they banked another $35 dollars for the extra month until I caught it.... which I am sure they tricked out of plenty other one-event buyers. The should have had a box to check in order to enroll in this program.... it was meant to be deceiving. Well Dickvision... you may have won the battle, but you lost the war. That dishonest $35 you took costs you 3 live event subscriptions from me a year.... or any chance of me subscibing to the package deals. Good job geniouses. 

I disagree about the "minimal effort" part of your statement.   It was all over their website, social media, on here, in your billing address email, etc for about a month before the World Finals.   What more could they have done other than making a personal phone call to every DV subscriber to explain the changes?   

I canceled after World Finals as well, but only after I saw the last thread about this on here.   

Yes there was an email sent to all subscribers that talked about the extension of subscriptions to include the Australian season, and other addiotnal stuff...etc.  However, the amount of junk emails I get from things I subscribe to and buy means I very rarely read emails from those entities carefully and many end up deleted.  

I am sure how Dirtvision handled this covered them from a legal standpoint, however, when most of us actually subcribed to the World of Outlaws Sprint Car Fastpass, the terms of the subcription included the understanding that it was for all the included World of Outlaw Sprint car events: a series that was contested in the US and whose season lasted from February-October or November depending on World Finals, with at least a two month break.  That is what we signed up to pay for and the product we agreed to purchase.

The additions were made and automatically rolled into any uncanceled subcription and the only way to know that it happened was to have read the email, seen it mentioned somewhere else (like a message board), or gotten an unexpected additional bill.  While I appreciate the additional content and it's value, I only bought the FastPass to watch live WoO Sprint Car races.  I don't have the ability to watch the Austrailian races live because of the time difference and have no interest in them tape delayed.  I also don't really have an interest in paying extra for the Late Models.  So I really have no need for the additional months.

A fundamental change was made to the product that I had originally purchased, and the onus was on me to see that the change had been made and decide whether I was ok with that.  So, while I'm sure this was done legally, it was also a little bit underhanded in the way it was handled.  

That is minimal effort if you are making a change to a purchased product.  It still puts the onus on the subscriber to understand and accept the change.

I may have been on the DIrtvision website once in the month before the World Finals for the Port Royal race, and that was to log on and watch the race, not scan the website, and because I attended Charlotte I didnt' log on during it.   The billing address email is fine, but how often do you get SPAM offers from companies you buy things from, same with ads on Social Media, often enough that you ignore most of what you see.

The product that was offered was fundamentally changed for people who had already subscribed to it.  Because of that, yes, I think a personal phone call would have been appropriate, since the terms of service were being significantly changed.  At the very least, a renewal notice should have been sent that didn't automatically roll over your subscription until you agreed to the new terms of the service.

I also got hit. I was told when I paid for Knox na t  I also agreed to this package. Well this was news to me. Emailed them and was told that I could had watched 12 other shows. NO REFUND   .  Sure good way to guarantee I will not use DV again. Usually only show front cars so not that great of coverage. I can listen to Knoxville computer so there loss. Money lost to save money down the road in future.

"Geniouses". Seems fitting.

I had originally made a post on this and the people who are posting that they informed us by email, social media, etc. are being extremely misleading and are absolutely wrong in this case. 

The first email with any information that was about Australian coverage was on October 24 and was titled "Perth Motorplex LIVE on DIRTVision.com!". 

I'll state it outright: This is not enough. Not even close.

Let me take you through my, and I'm guessing many others' thought process - I saw the email and didn't open it. Why? It doesn't have anything to do with the sprint car Fast Pass. This is them advertising that they are covering Australian sprint car racing - nothing else. I don't have any interest in staying up overnight to watch racing in the winter, nor do I have any interest in watching tape delayed racing.

Also, even if I had opened the email, the notice is a one paragraph blurb buried at the bottom after the release with the information on DV adding Perth coverage. Take note, they could have used an email title of "Perth Motorplex added to DIRTVision.com Fast Pass!" or "DIRTVision.com Fast Past goes Down Under with Perth Motorplex Coverage!", both of which are reasonable titles that clearly state what is happening to your account.

Let's use Netflix as a comparison. This would be the same as if they sent out an email stating "New This Month on Netflix!" and then adding a rider at the bottom that your subscription terms have changed. It's asinine. 

However, a large corporation like Netflix would never end up at this level - they would send an email notice with a clear and concise title of "Upcoming changes for your Netflix account" or "Important: We are changing your the terms of your Netflix account" to where it is ABSOLUTELY CLEAR that something is changing. 

And for the social media/website stuff, bullshit. Just flat out bullshit. I  didn't want to post this but am going to given the flat out falsity that was stated. I actually got my money refunded after the fact because I pointed out to them that they had not corrected their terms and conditions on the website. 

Additionally, I originally emailed them and posted to HH about this on November 13, which was ironically the day that DV made the first tweet that indicated that it was part of the Fast Pass. If anyone can find me any mention of Australia being added to and specifically extended to the Fast Pass prior to November 13, I'll eat my crow. In fact, it even seems to be the opposite - they tweeted Nov. 1 about an Australian race that clearly states it will be in the vault for Fast Pass customers VOD after the fact. Does that indicate it's part of Fast Pass coverage? Not to me.

To conclude, at best, this was a pretty convenient issue of incompetence for DV. In reality, I absolutely believe they were intentionally trying to shroud the fact that this was happening, which is a shame given how good their service has been since instituting the Fast Pass. I understand the goal of every company and/or corporation is to generate revenue, and if DV isn't making enough, raise the Fast Pass price to make up for it - at least that's being up front. Don't pull shit like this and completely mislead your customers - that's messing with customer trust, which is very difficult to get back.

For those of you who pay so much attention to what DirtVision says, you would notice that there is an ENTIRE EMAIL from October 24th that solely talks about the racing from Perth being aired on DV and that your fast pass subscription will be renewed every 4 weeks through the offseason. I did not think it was hidden at all, its not like most companies where they will make the font 6 sizes smaller and a color just dark enough from the backround to barely be seen. It is in the body of their main article. 

Per the Terms and conditions posted on the DirtVision website - "By accessing or using DIRTvision.com, you agree to the terms. The terms are meant to protect all of our website visitors and your use of this website signifies your agreement with these terms. IF YOU DO NOT AGREE WITH THESE TERMS, DO NOT USE THIS WEBSITE. World Racing Group reserves the right, in its sole discretion, to modify, alter or otherwise update these terms at any time. Such modifications shall be effective immediately upon posting. By using DIRTvision.com after we have posted notice of such modifications, alterations or updates you agree to be bound by such revised terms."
 

They then go on to explain that you will be billed every 28 days consecutively until you request a cancellation, and said request must be made 48 hours prior to your next billing date to not be billed. Since everyone is making a stink about them "Following their terms", you're forgetting that you agreed that they would be able to change their terms at any time by signing up in the first place. The point is, the terms were changed, as is their right to do so, and an email was sent out on the 24th explaining the change by talking about the Australian races, and the billing information was also listed in that email. If that information was missed by anyone, that is not a DV problem.

Completely disagree, and I don't even know if I'd call it a minimal effort issue, I feel it's closer to them strategically implementing this to ensure customers were not aware of the changes.

Try again.

I directly copied from their T&C on November 14th the following to an email to DV:  

DIRTVision will suspend billing prior to World Finals, until the start of the following season. Any unused days of your 28-day cycle will be credited when billing resumes when the following season begins.  

I was immediately refunded.

I too, directly copied from their terms and conditions on the 18th. Must have missed it by 4 days, but oh well. I cancelled mine, because I knew it was coming, from the email I received about Perth, and them stating that fast pass was going to be billed all year long.  I pay attention to emails from companies I give money to, whether its in regards to what I directly paid for or not, because you never know when things like this will come about.