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Topic: 10 time woo sprint champion Email this topic to a friend | Subscribe to this TopicReport this Topic to Moderator
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ortim
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November 01, 2018 at 06:00:11 PM
Joined: 08/07/2008
Posts: 149
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its official as of tonight donny has been crowned 10 time champion congrats to a great run




Murphy
November 04, 2018 at 05:34:32 PM
Joined: 05/26/2005
Posts: 3262
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Posted By: ortim on November 01 2018 at 06:00:11 PM

its official as of tonight donny has been crowned 10 time champion congrats to a great run



      Does that now officially make him half the driver that Steve Kinser is? wink



dirtraceorbust
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November 04, 2018 at 09:14:07 PM
Joined: 10/10/2009
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Hey,  lets just remember that as Wolfgang said in his book, "it seemed like every night either Kinser or Swindell or myself won all the races".  Wasn't much competition in victory lane in that era.  But for the past 15+ years, every driver has the same equipment.  Those are facts that you've read in both sprint car magazines, in Wolfgang's book, in Trostle's book, in interviews with today's drivers, etc.  "Half the driver that Steve Kinser is?"  A good one! 


Lawlessness + liberalism = HELL -  NYC, Detroit, Chicago, 
Seattle, LA  Who the H runs those cities. 


RodinCanada
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November 04, 2018 at 10:37:59 PM
Joined: 07/24/2016
Posts: 1720
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I think its pretty ironic that he sealed the championship on a night they didnt actually race. 


Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!

Murphy
November 05, 2018 at 08:16:22 AM
Joined: 05/26/2005
Posts: 3262
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Posted By: dirtraceorbust on November 04 2018 at 09:14:07 PM

Hey,  lets just remember that as Wolfgang said in his book, "it seemed like every night either Kinser or Swindell or myself won all the races".  Wasn't much competition in victory lane in that era.  But for the past 15+ years, every driver has the same equipment.  Those are facts that you've read in both sprint car magazines, in Wolfgang's book, in Trostle's book, in interviews with today's drivers, etc.  "Half the driver that Steve Kinser is?"  A good one! 



     I'm not knocking Schatz. I'm poking fun at the idea that people want to use math and twisted logic to "prove" that one driver is better than another. Smile It's all pretty subjective.

     I didn't go back and look, but in any given year, haven't the majority of WoO races been won by 3 racers?

     



dsc1600
November 05, 2018 at 08:27:11 AM
Joined: 05/31/2007
Posts: 4373
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Another thing that’s becoming more amazing with each passing year, 2 drivers have won 30 of the 41 championships. 




Nickules
November 05, 2018 at 09:42:30 AM
Joined: 08/05/2015
Posts: 1133
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Posted By: dsc1600 on November 05 2018 at 08:27:11 AM

Another thing that’s becoming more amazing with each passing year, 2 drivers have won 30 of the 41 championships. 



Wow. I mean I anecdotally knew that (or something like it) but seeing it written out, geez. Wow.



Nickules
November 05, 2018 at 09:45:07 AM
Joined: 08/05/2015
Posts: 1133
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Saw a tweet saying that Don Don finished in the Top 10 of ALL but 5 races with no DNFs (his lowest finish was 14th).  Think about that for second. That's is ridiculously consistent and remarkable.



ryanhunsinger
November 05, 2018 at 10:51:06 AM
Joined: 12/10/2016
Posts: 149
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The crazy thing is that even with as dominant Donny has been for what seems like forever, he still has less than 40% of the total woo wins that Steve has (261 to 690) and he’s still around 135 away from Sammy in 2nd all time. Donny would have to win 29 features a year for the next 15 straight years to get to the top of the list. 




dsc1600
November 05, 2018 at 11:09:33 AM
Joined: 05/31/2007
Posts: 4373
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Posted By: ryanhunsinger on November 05 2018 at 10:51:06 AM

The crazy thing is that even with as dominant Donny has been for what seems like forever, he still has less than 40% of the total woo wins that Steve has (261 to 690) and he’s still around 135 away from Sammy in 2nd all time. Donny would have to win 29 features a year for the next 15 straight years to get to the top of the list. 



He’s up to 283 now, after 22 wins this season. Steve was 41 in 1995 and by then he must have had over 400 wins at least. If he stays hungry 500 wins is in reach, but even that would require him to win more in his 40s than all but 2 drivers have won in their entire careers. 



blazer00
November 05, 2018 at 11:10:05 AM
Joined: 06/10/2015
Posts: 2420
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Posted By: dirtraceorbust on November 04 2018 at 09:14:07 PM

Hey,  lets just remember that as Wolfgang said in his book, "it seemed like every night either Kinser or Swindell or myself won all the races".  Wasn't much competition in victory lane in that era.  But for the past 15+ years, every driver has the same equipment.  Those are facts that you've read in both sprint car magazines, in Wolfgang's book, in Trostle's book, in interviews with today's drivers, etc.  "Half the driver that Steve Kinser is?"  A good one! 



Not much competition in victory lane? No, just Kinser, Swindell and Wolfgang, that's all!  In that era there were three "Donny Schatz's" driving sprint cars.  Only one of those, Kinser, made a full carreer of the WoO. Sammy missed a lot of years and Doug only had 5 or 6 seasons in total running the WoO tour.  Donny doesn't have competition like that, and that's a fact. Too many keep laying the success of the Big 3 on the equipment that they had.  Bullshit!   Steve and Sammy were winning WoO features in to their late 50's.  They both finished in the top five in season points in 2012, Steve age 58 and Sammy age 57.  Sammy actually had the most total wins that year.  So much for the argument that the equipment was the main reason for their winning. Way past their primes they were still winning when, as you put it, every driver had the same equipment.  They were great racers, plain and simple.  And who knows what Wolfgang would have done if his carreer hadn't been cut so short.  Schatz is the very best of his era, no doubt, and what he has accomplished is remarkable.  If he were to choose to go after Kinser's WoO title win total, he might very well do it.  But it sounds like he's ready to focus on other things in his life.  He's earned the right to do whatever he damn well chooses!



revjimk
November 05, 2018 at 11:33:07 AM
Joined: 09/14/2010
Posts: 7595
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Posted By: ryanhunsinger on November 05 2018 at 10:51:06 AM

The crazy thing is that even with as dominant Donny has been for what seems like forever, he still has less than 40% of the total woo wins that Steve has (261 to 690) and he’s still around 135 away from Sammy in 2nd all time. Donny would have to win 29 features a year for the next 15 straight years to get to the top of the list. 



So i guess Steve will still be King...




Murphy
November 05, 2018 at 06:45:09 PM
Joined: 05/26/2005
Posts: 3262
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     For what it's worth, during the 41 seasons of the WoO, the top 3 feature winners each year on average, took 2/3 of the wins.  The highest percentage was 96% in 1981. The lowest was 43% in 2011. There was only 2 years, 2011 and 2001 when the number was below 50%. I don't see any trend that suggests that will change any time soon.



chathamracefan1
November 05, 2018 at 08:58:28 PM
Joined: 08/03/2008
Posts: 241
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That stat about only 5 nights outside top 10 is on the level of his Knoxville top 2 streak every year since 2005.  I don’t like to see him win all the time but he is just so good you can’t not be in awe of his talent. 



RodinCanada
MyWebsite
November 05, 2018 at 09:03:43 PM
Joined: 07/24/2016
Posts: 1720
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I believe Donny used at least 2 provisionals. I guess it was earned feature spots in the bank for a bad day at the races. Then finishing 14 or better tells another story.


Even though I may not know you, I 
care what most of you think!


revjimk
November 06, 2018 at 08:49:57 AM
Joined: 09/14/2010
Posts: 7595
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Schatz had more than twice the wins of his nearest competitor: 22 to 9

Best winning percentage? Lance Dewease! Won 2 of the 4 races he entered, batting .500!



dsc1600
November 06, 2018 at 08:55:30 AM
Joined: 05/31/2007
Posts: 4373
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Reply to:
Posted By: revjimk on November 06 2018 at 08:49:57 AM

Schatz had more than twice the wins of his nearest competitor: 22 to 9

Best winning percentage? Lance Dewease! Won 2 of the 4 races he entered, batting .500!



Using Posse logic, if he’d have followed the whole series he’d have won 36 of 71 races! Haha



racefanigan
November 06, 2018 at 09:17:27 AM
Joined: 07/31/2007
Posts: 230
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This message was edited on November 06, 2018 at 09:19:15 AM by racefanigan
Reply to:
Posted By: blazer00 on November 05 2018 at 11:10:05 AM

Not much competition in victory lane? No, just Kinser, Swindell and Wolfgang, that's all!  In that era there were three "Donny Schatz's" driving sprint cars.  Only one of those, Kinser, made a full carreer of the WoO. Sammy missed a lot of years and Doug only had 5 or 6 seasons in total running the WoO tour.  Donny doesn't have competition like that, and that's a fact. Too many keep laying the success of the Big 3 on the equipment that they had.  Bullshit!   Steve and Sammy were winning WoO features in to their late 50's.  They both finished in the top five in season points in 2012, Steve age 58 and Sammy age 57.  Sammy actually had the most total wins that year.  So much for the argument that the equipment was the main reason for their winning. Way past their primes they were still winning when, as you put it, every driver had the same equipment.  They were great racers, plain and simple.  And who knows what Wolfgang would have done if his carreer hadn't been cut so short.  Schatz is the very best of his era, no doubt, and what he has accomplished is remarkable.  If he were to choose to go after Kinser's WoO title win total, he might very well do it.  But it sounds like he's ready to focus on other things in his life.  He's earned the right to do whatever he damn well chooses!



I do not think anyone is disputing the fast that Steve, Sammy, and Doug were a couple of the best to every be in the sport, there is no doubt that is the case, as like you said, both Steve and Sammy won races when the equipment evened out, which I would say is the late 90s to early 2000s when everyone pretty much had the same thing, but the point is from 78 until then, Steve, Sammy, and Doug were pretty much one step ahead of the everyone else. I've known Doug my entire life, I raced with Robby and I worked with doug for a couple years at a local tree and lawn care firm, he was the moring mechanic, and I would see him every day. I specifically remember him telling me about the lightweight car they built, which everyone can read in his book, which is the same thing that Karl Kinser had at that time too. Doug and Steve were really the only ones running a car lighter than everyone else, (well, Karls started with Dick Gaines). I am sure with them doing that, Smmy likely had the same thing. Not sure about any others that may have done that, but he made it sound like it was really them three that had a car that was far lighter than everyone else. Theres one advantage. Another story that doug had told me is that when a manufacturer came out with something new, namely when he drove for Weikert, they bought every piece they made, so nobody else could have it. If winters came out with a new rear end, and they made 10 of them, they bought all 10 so they could have them all to themselves. Basically, according to him, with the slower manufacturing processes of those days, that would put them at least half a year ahead of everyone. 

Don't kid yourself, they sure had advantages back then that are no longer available today. HOWEVER, I am not disputing the fact that they were still the best that ever did it, and I believe Schatz is on par with what Kinser was, possibly even better, considering that you can't spend more on a motor to get more HP than the field, you can't make your car 50 lbs lighter than the field, let alone a couple hundred like they could in the 70s/80s. etc. The simple fact is that equipment is more equal and off the shelf now than it ever has been, some people can just figure out how to make it go faster than others, and that is what Donny is doing.




revjimk
November 06, 2018 at 10:32:42 AM
Joined: 09/14/2010
Posts: 7595
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Posted By: dsc1600 on November 06 2018 at 08:55:30 AM

Using Posse logic, if he’d have followed the whole series he’d have won 36 of 71 races! Haha



Yea, but I never said that!

I'm not trying BS anyone, obviously his wins were on home tracks.... but???



highspeeddirt
November 06, 2018 at 10:58:13 AM
Joined: 01/06/2009
Posts: 399
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My opinion is Schatz is done with sprints in 3 to 5 years and running a late model with Stewart as owner.





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