Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

To make sprints and midgets more enjoyable.

More feature laps.

How many times in a fans life have we said "Man, five more laps" etc.

If fan admission goes up $5,. give them 5 more laps.

I'm a 305 guy and I hate busting my ass for weeks at a time to only get to race 20 laps.

I'm also a huge fan that spends a ton of vacation time to watch the best in the world only to watch 25 laps.

Sprint car races need to be longer.  10 minute features aren't worth several vacation days and extremely expensive hotel rooms.

25 and 30 lap winged sprint car races need to be a thing of the past.

I love sprint cars with all my heart, but I need to see more for my time in person.  

If not, ill just watch on YouTube highlights during commercials of Big Bang Theory.

Just being honest.

Brandon McLain
United Sprint Car Series Driver
2014 Season
National Rookie of the Year!
National Points - 8th
Southern Points - 3rd
Asphalt Points - 3rd
18 Races, 3 Top 5's, 14 Top 10's

Don't give me 30 minutes of talking to drivers about their favorite cheeseburger while drawing for starter positions.  Just add ten more laps of racing

At this point the cars are so extremely equal,  do away with the dash and add those laps to the feature.  

Most of these tracks can handle all the cars that showed up. Let them all start and add an additional 12 laps to the feature

. 

Brandon McLain
United Sprint Car Series Driver
2014 Season
National Rookie of the Year!
National Points - 8th
Southern Points - 3rd
Asphalt Points - 3rd
18 Races, 3 Top 5's, 14 Top 10's

Attract more of the young people by reducing the cost of general admission for those over 12 years old.  The cost should not be more than 1/2 the cost of general admission.  How can a family of Dad, Mom and 2 or 3 teens afford to attend?  They are the future and in many cases are being shut out.

To back up your thoughts, here's a story some of you old timers may enjoy:

At the Cowtown Sprint Nationals I set and advertised the feature to be 35 laps, because it was a big race and it was a 1/4 mile track...plus there was a huge field of sprints in the pits, and my thoughts were you wanted to give guys some extra time to get through the field the best that they could without feeling like they had to take extra unnecessary chances and tear up their car.

Then in the pit meeting Tommy Estes Jr said the feature was going to be 30 laps. So I went up to him and said that tonight is special and it's been advertised to be 35. He said: we don't run 35 laps features.

Then I whispered to him: "remember when you came to Jackson Speedway in the 80's for your first time in the Doug and Joanne Howells #4 and you were grumbling that you didn't like that I had the 2nd Twin Feature lineup inverted? And do you remember how that turned out?" (he ended up winning both feature races and left the place with like $3,700...and back then, that was quite the payday, especially for a $15 pit pass and no entry fee.)

So after that, he erased the 30 on the board and changed it to 35. (Him and I have chuckled about this since then when we met up at another track down the road.)

The feature race rolled out and Jason Johnson led with Brian Brown stalking him most of the race and as the pair came down to the white flag, on lap 34, Brown would squeeze under Johnson and catch just enough of Bo Rawdon's moisture on the bottom of corner one to pull even with Johnson...and Brown would end up sneaking by for the win the next time by at the checkers.

Another quick example was at the LoneStar Sprint Nationals, where Wayne Johnson would start 11th and pick his way through the field, taking home a $13,000 win...and I had that set for a 40-lap feature. No scheduled fuel stop either.

In summary, I've always been an advocate for a bit longer features. The fans deserve it.

And I can't believe how many races this season where I saw fans get short changed by Series dropping their features by 5 laps or whatever off their advertised distance, for one reason after another, and IMO, that's not how to build events or get fans to return.   

I remember when all NCRA races were 50 laps. And the term "fuel stop" hadn't even been coined yet...

Member of this message board since 1997

Pa tracks are mostly under twelve free and 12 to 18 reduced price. It was less than half adult price now it is a little over half. I think that change was a mistake. My wife and I have traveled some the last few years and one thing we notice is, not as many families at races outside Pa. as at home.

I'd rather see longer races too, but longer 410 races will require more fuel stops which many fans don't like. Starting all cars is silly, a couple of provisionals are more than enough. Start them all sounds like the beginning of a demo derby. If you don't make the show try again next time. Whats next, participation trophies?

I also like the idea of a little bit longer races. I'm not sure it would work with today's 410s due to fuel consumption, and tire wear. Both are likely to lead to mandatory stops, which I'm not a big fan of. Maybe if a larger fuel cell or mandated?

That's why sprint car racing doesn't work on TV.   80% of the show or more winds up being driver interviews.    Green flag racing action uses up very little of the time.   Think about this, add another 10 laps at one of these faster quarter miles where the lap times are low.   You've added less than 2 minutes of racing action.    All that said, I'm also in favor of dropping the dash draw and the dash too.   The WoO should do that and inverted a couple of rows in the heat races and then you might actually see something other than a freight train.  

I don't disagree with you that pricing is important. But dirt track racing in general is one of the most economical forms of entertainment you can choose to attend.

Knoxville is $15 adults. Kids under 12 free. Have you attended any other entertainment event? Monster truck show? A concert? College football? Pro sports? NASCAR? If families and kids aren't coming I would suggest it's not because of ticket prices. Tracks do have to make it entertaining. They do have to keep everyone's attention and interest. And they have to get done at a decent time so families can get home. And look back on the evening and say "we'd absolutely love to do that again!"

Sometimes the things that make it a great evening for the younger crowd and families goes against what the old guard wants to see. "I've been at races until 3 am" "It's not fair that team didn't get more time in the work area" Ad nauseum. If we want the sport to survive there needs to be some flexibility To make it workable to attract families. And it's not the ticket prices right now making a difference. Those are already reasonable compared to any alternative. 

Here's the thing though, if I go to a concert I don't get 15 minutes of music and 1 1/2 hours of interviews.   I get two hours or more of solid music.   NASCAR may suck but their races are hours long and few interviews by comparison.   The last concert I went to was only marginally more expensive than my Knoxville Nationals ticket.   

I live in the South with up to 11 classes of cars a night at $20 ticket prices.  I would gladly double that to watch just 2 or 3 classes.  Every one of our shows are two-day shows. Start Saturday after, end sometime Sunday morning.  I'll give a track around here $10 mores if they promised to get me out of the track at a decent time.

Plus 30 minutes of track prep just so the first two laps are fun before it goes right back to the previous track conditions aren't worth the wait.  Just race and be done with it.  

Brandon McLain
United Sprint Car Series Driver
2014 Season
National Rookie of the Year!
National Points - 8th
Southern Points - 3rd
Asphalt Points - 3rd
18 Races, 3 Top 5's, 14 Top 10's

Maybe the answer there is make the fuel stop just a fuel stop. 5 minutes, tops.

Wow. So now we're comparing to Nationals tickets? Thats not what the post was originally about. But since you've brought it up...you don't enjoy the Nationals? You see it as 15 minutes of racing and a bunch of interviews? And you think it's a poor value compared to a concert? $60 for Saturday night Nationals tickets. That's a B or C class concert. I wouldn't trade Saturday night at the Nationals for that concert and think the Nationals is an awesome value. You must not enjoy sprint car racing given your comments. 

Stop having fuel stops...Advertise the race distance, the teams will figure it out if they want to finish.

Member of this message board since 1997

I get what you're saying but I respectfully disagree.  It doesn't matter the distance, there will ALWAYS be a race where five more laps would've made it more exciting (because of various things like a car getting faster late in the race or a leader burning their tires off), this happens in NASCAR too, even after 500 miles.  It's a short distance, almost like a sprint (you like what I did there lol), that's the way it goes sometimes.  As someone else said the longer distances just add wear and tear to the car.  And as someone else said with tire wear and fuel consumption not being able to go a longer distance, do people then just "ride around" for the first five or ten laps to save their stuff for the end?  That's not real exciting either.

My final point why I don't like the idea.  Take a look at the Knoxville Nationals.  They have a fifty lap race with a break around halftime.  Do you think this has made the racing better?  I think it's kind of cool how it's setup, ONLY because it's the only race like that for the (at least for WOO and HL) but I certainly don't want to watch that every night.  I don't really think it's added anything to the racing portion of the show.  It's just that now there's a break and a time to go to the bathroom.  I think if there was that many people who really wanted that, more races like that would've popped up since then.  Like I said I am respectfully disagreeing and this is just my opinion.

I wouldn't drive 700 miles and pay $50+ per night if I didn't enjoy it, even if I only get 20 minutes of action per night.   The OP was about cutting out the driver interviews and adding laps wasn't it?   That's because the OP sees some of the same issues I do.   

It seems the OP was about value for one's money. Number of laps to watch.. Etc. Then others weighed in, including yourself I believe, that tracks needed to do better providing value for the consumer and giving better ticket prices to attract the younger crowd. My rebuttal was simply I think that prices have little to do with attracting families as they are already far better value than other forms of entertainment. knoxvill as an example already provides 12 and under free and adult prices of $15. If you think that's the issue then you dont understand prices for other forms of entertainment. They are by no far greater. It's other things like keeping the show moving, maintaining interest, and getting people home at a decent time that matter to attracting families and the younger crowd 

I actually agree with you for the most part.   I agree that ticket prices aren't actually the big issue.   Too much dead time in the programs is a problem.   I should have used just a regular WoO show at a place where 410 racing is pretty much nonexistent, like Texas, as an example.     Car counts can be a problem, lack of passing in the heats, and way too much down time wasted with driver interviews.   The OP is correct on that.   I was just pointing out that adding 10 laps on a fast quarter mile or 1/3 mile doesn't add much racing time.    This is a big problem for short track racing in general.   Solve that and maybe there is a "next level" for sprint car racing.   I doubt it though...

For weekly shows the general admission for teens up to 18 years old should not be more than $5.  A 13 year old is not an adult!