Forum: HoseHeads Sprint Car General Forum (go)
Moderators: dirtonly  /  dmantx  /  hosehead

What a slow program...

Not only slow, but I thought it was more sketchy than DD was the alternate and a local driver stopped on lap one, getting DD in the show. I also noticed that Marci pulled in with 3 laps to go on a restart over a disagreement of track position. Ah, so much drama in Posse Land...�

Kind of crazy that the Grove went 40 years without an All Star victory and now the 4th best all star dominates the local show. What's going on Cubes? 

DD did not gain entry into the A main after Mackison stopped on lap 1. No one can gain entry after the initial green is thrown. The field is locked in at that point. DD finished 7th in the B one spot out of a transfer. Shearer was the last transfer. A main line up was read with Shearer starting 24th and shortly after it was announced Shearer scratched putting DD in as the first alternate. I would point you to DD's twitter post about last night. He owns the fact that he bought the spot meaning Shearer was paid to scratch. No rule against it. I haven't seen it in awhile and there are no provisionals for a regular show. It took me back to the days before the Outlaws had provisionals and this was a more regular occurrence. Bigger picture he is running for points and got a 9th place finish.  Time will tell how this all plays out until years end but those points from last night could prove to be very important. 

I am not even a DD fan, but I have NO PROBLEM if his team threw Shearer a few bucks to scratch.....as a fan, it made for better entertainment watching him drive from the back.

I have absolutely no problem with it either. I just thought it interesting because it's something I haven't seen in awhile. He at least made something out of a night that could have been a huge points hit. 

If this is a stupid question don't beat me uo too bad.

Why did DD go to Port Royal tonight instead of Lincoln?

The worst president of my lifetime:
Ronald Reagan

DD has stated he is not running for the point championship at Lincoln this season. He will spend the majority of Saturday nights at Lincoln, but will race at Port Royal from time to time especially for the bigger paying shows.

Feature was pretty boring...

By the way.... what happened to Lance at Port Royal????? ( I missed TTs & heats)

Some big paying shows at Port again this year with 9 races paying 10k or more to win, 2 of them over 25k to win I'd guess, same reason Macri, Madsen and many of the others of the 30 that were there.  Just my opinion.  Was a good field and good race. 

it was mostly slow because bryan bernheisel flipped his late model out of the track.  it sounds like he has multiple spine fractures.

there's always so much complaining about the surfaces at port and lincoln.  it seems like it's just accepted that the surface at the grove will be terrible and so is the racing.  i think they had only completed 1 lap of the first late model heat when this happened.  surface looked rough and upset the car enough to eventually get him upside down.  no catch fence in the corner of course to keep the car from going down the hill behind the corner.

i happened to see that the track was sued back in 2014 by a driver who was paralyzed in a similar crash.  what was the outcome of that?  i get the whole "you assume the risk when you sign" concept.  something should hold the tracks accountable for basic safety measures though.  you would probably need something that amounts to a strike.  considering their car counts are often terrible despite being the only 410 show on fridays...maybe that's what we're already seeing.

Jon Westbrook(sp) was injured in the crash you are bringing up. He flipped out of the turn and hit some excavating equipment. Not my business to know the outcome between him and the track, but he has fielded a sprint car there for 3 or 4 years as well as other tracks. Jon was an exciting driver to watch and I'm glad to see him still participating in the sport.

 Hopefully Bernheisel will fully recover, thats a long way down that hill. I used to rag on the Grove's surface quite a bit years ago but the times have changed and that place is about as racey as it can probably be anymore. I'm glad to be going back there on Friday nights again.

The new school fans don't appreciate Williams Grove like they should. It's like Pennsylvania's version of Terre Haute. It's one of the last true widowmakers. It takes nerves of steel to drive into those tight corners wide open. Ask any driver and most will tell you that Williams Grove is the toughest and most physically demanding track they race on. It's extremely difficult to figure it out and it takes a crew chief who knows his shit to get a car rolling nice around there. It's an extremely technical track. Greg Hodnett once said that the G forces there are incredible. It doesn't matter what anyone else does, Williams Grove is and always will be the most important track in Central PA. Some people don't want to hear that, but it's the truth.

I agree. I have wrecked at least 7 million dollars worth of sprint cars there on iracing just in the month of March. �

i agree it's most important.  that also doesn't mean it has to stay the way it is.  i've had to adjust to the idea around here that being a track that's a "widowmaker" is a badge of honor...not a criticism.  

You need to follow some different sports, maybe like curling or golf maybe.  I've never heard anyone I know say the Grove is a widow maker. Keith Kaufman told me the Grove definately is the fastest down the staights. But really, are you going to call every half mile track a widow maker now because someone gets injured.? I was at Lincoln when Lance busted up his neck and back and it didn't look like that bad of a crash, then Kramer had his accident. I don't hear anyone calling Lincoln a widow maker. I've seen bad accidents on quarter mile tracks. We all love our racers and wish them the best but you gotta realize you can't bubble wrap the world, you have to let people do what they have a desire to do, just stand back and appreciate it or close your eyes and don't watch.

i'm not the one who called it that.  somebody else did.  

i follow lots of other forms of racing where it's not like this.  things happen and then changes are made to keep them from happening again.  indycar left pocono for getting people hurt.  f1 is putting halos over the cars and finally started having full course safety cars.  earnhardt died and nascar changed just about everything.  

i can't expect soft walls on every track given the expense...although dirt tracks that are making significant upgrades are being rewarded with nascar events.  a fence or barriers that could actually hold back a car or moving cars out of the pits seem like basic expectations.  it's out of my respect for sprint cars that i'd like to see these things...because they're running first world race cars at third world facilities in most cases.

It is a badge of honor. Why do some guys decide to be bullriders? Let's do rock climbing or sky diving? It's the adrenaline rush. Sprint car racing isn't a bloodsport by any means but those who do it make a deal with themselves every time they strap in. They know the risks in general and they know the specific risks of each facility. They accept it and it isn't your business or anyone else's to say that they shouldn't. If they want changes to be made bad enough, they'll be vocal about it and have them made. No one wants to see anyone get hurt or injured but anyone who sets there and watches sprint cars do what they do also knows the risk of what can happen but it's the thrill you get that keeps you coming back. And if you think part of the thrill isn't derived from the inherent dangers posed by open wheel cars that are feather light going way faster than they should isn't part of that thrill, you're lying to everyone lncluding yourself.

It's not as much of a condemnation on PA cars as it is the quality of the All Star field. I think we can all agree the ASCOC is significantly stronger over the past 5 years. Before that it was mostly a bunch of the top level weekly cars from the Ohio area and Dale Blaney. Look at Reutzel who moved from ASCOC direclty to being competitive at the front of the WoO series nightly. Right on his heels in points is Eliason who is still an ASCOC driver and Marks who is ASCOC as well. 

Also, I wouldn't be surprised if Justin Peck is signifcantly better than the 4th best ASCOC driver this season. He has looked great. The front row starts definitely helped him win those races but on nights when he hasn't started on the front row he still moves forward. 

Have you ever stood in the infield and watched the cars go into the corners at the Grove? Nobody goes into the corners wide open there, not even hotlaps. If they did they, they would be out of the park before they could even get the car turned. WG still has the biggest 410 races purse wise and the most WOO shows, but as far as a weekly program, it's a shell of what it used to be. The racing is generally lackluster as well. IMO Port is far ahead in facility, racing and weekly fields. Not just 410's but Port is also probably the top super late model track in the country now. WG is lucky to draw full fields of 410's or 358's. It's a far cry from 20 years ago when WG drew all the top 410 teams in central PA, plus 40-50 358's. The tracks size and shape is just not ideal for modern day sprint car racing.  Shorten those straights, make the track wider and add some banking to the turns. When that's done, move the 410 pits out of the infield to the area outside turns 1-2. Now you've got a 21st century dirt track!  

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